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Need a math Guru to figure this out

Discussion in 'Ford/Lincoln Hybrids and EVs' started by acdii, Dec 23, 2012.

  1. acdii

    acdii Active Member

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    I am lousy at percentages, so hopefully someone here can considering there are some rally bright people on this forum.

    2010 FFH, rated 36 Highway, 41 City 39 Combined

    Cold weather driving, seeing about 36 MPG over a 23 mile 90-10 highway/city with 55 MPH limit.

    2013 FFH rated 47/47/47

    Cold weather driving, seeing about 34 MPG same exact trip, driven exactly the same.

    Temp is at 23 * F.

    What are the percentages for subtraction of cold weather, and mathematically what should be the expected MPG for each car?
     
  2. Paradox

    Paradox Prius Enthusiast / Moderator
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    Moved out of the news forum.
     
  3. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    I don't think it's possible to come up with one. There are too many factors that can affect mileage in cold weather (Why mileage gets worse in winter | PriusChat).

    Your drive is nothing like the EPA tests (Car and Driver: The Truth About EPA City / Highway MPG Estimates | PriusChat).

    And, as pointed out in other threads that I haven't been following, it's unclear how much the max 62 mph EV speed of the current gen FFH vs. other differences help it on the EPA test.

    We already know your '13 FFH and its tires aren't broken in either. Many (most?) cars see a slight increase in mpg over time, but it's unclear how much of that is due to tire changes (Tire Tech Information - Tire Rolling Resistance Part 3: Changes to Expect When Switching from Worn-Out to New Tires) vs. other factors.
     
  4. acdii

    acdii Active Member

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    Theoretically speaking.

    Just trying to determine if what I am seeing in loss on the new car is feasible. If you look at what I get in warmer weather in the 2010, which is 39, and in 23* weather it drops to 36, whats that percentage. Should I not see a similar percentage drop on the 2013?

    I also dont give a hoot that its not an EPA test, its a real world test between similar cars on the same roads, same temps, same exact driving conditions to compare each car to the other.

    So in Theory I should expect to see a higher MPG reading on the 2013 that is rated at 47 combined than the 2010 that is rated 39 combined, should I not?

    Isnt there some calculation regarding temp drop vs ICE MPG?
     
  5. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    Your percent is 36/39 x 100% = 92% or an 8% drop in cold weather.

    Your drop in the new fusion may be different. If the new engine is more efficient, it may take longer to warm up, and may have a longer warm up penalty. It also has active grill shutters which may reduce the warm up penalty.

    Yes all things being equal you should see better mileage on the new car, but there is no easy cold weather formula.
     
  6. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Yep. WAY too many variables.... even if the temps were the same, there's still the issue of how well optimized each car is for a given speed and I already pointed out the break-in issues earlier.
    You should because you keep citing EPA numbers and have some expectation of obtaining mileage similar to them or within some delta.
     
  7. acdii

    acdii Active Member

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    Of all the hybrids I have driven, this new one is the only one that does get anywhere near the rated numbers no matter what I do. Yeah I know its an estimate, but still out of the other 3 I had, the Prius, the TCH, I was always near them no matter what the temps were. All I'm looking for is a gradient of what to expect. Someone on another forum said up to 17 MPG drop in the cold. That seems pretty far excessive, especially since I have never seen that much of a drop on any of the other cars. The Prius had the largest drop, of 15, but it was also -10* F that day.

    I need to gather up as much information as I can to present to my dealer that there is something not right with this car, considering it gets no where near what I am getting in my 3 Year old car, and I doubt I will gain that much MPG once it breaks in.
     
  8. rkk

    rkk Junior Member

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    acdii, out of curiosity have you driven another 2013 just to see if it is any different?
     
  9. acdii

    acdii Active Member

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    I wish I could but they are hard to find. One of the other people I know who had a 2012 and was averaging 43 MPG got a new 2013 and from what I heard is not doing too well either, but that was through the dealer, so without talking to him direct, I cant say for sure.

    However I did test drive a Cmax and did better in that one than I did in the Fusion when I test drove it. Should have been a sign. On the short test drive it got 38 MPG. My Father in Law has a Cmax too, and is getting 43 in it.
     
  10. coach81

    coach81 Active Member

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    I wish someone like DeeCee could tell us her experiences here... (and I hope I can get her results also btw)...