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Prius II Lease...

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Main Forum' started by pingnak, Jun 27, 2012.

?

Should I keep it?

  1. Buy it.

    4 vote(s)
    44.4%

  2. Give it back.

    3 vote(s)
    33.3%

  3. Trade it for a...

    1 vote(s)
    11.1%

  4. In Soviet Russia, Lease Return You.

    1 vote(s)
    11.1%
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  1. pingnak

    pingnak New Member

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    If I get another car, it will be a hatchback, and that narrows it down. But there are months left on the lease, so for the moment I'm looking at options to mull over.
     
    #21 pingnak, Jun 30, 2012
  2. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    You know... when I hear people say that they hate driving, assuming they don't have to drive in a place where it's nuts to drive IMHO (like Manhattan), I'd almost guess they're driving the wrong car.

    When I still had my Z, I'd intentionally go driving on twisties (not so near me) for a few hours in a clear afternoon. When I had my Maxima, it was a pleasure to drive on the highways (not at all on twisties). I'd sometimes go out of my way to just drive on the highway somewhere and come back.
    It REALLY depends on the city. In San Jose, the bus system is HORRIBLE for my area. I'd taken it before when I was in middle school and high school.

    The closest grocery store from home is 2.7 miles away or 7 minutes drive.

    If I want to go there on a weekday afternoon, Google trip planner tells me it'd be 38 minutes, one way! That doesn't include waiting for the bus. Oh, and if the bus doesn't stop for you (it's happened to me w/this transit authority), during non-"peak" times, you gotta wait 1 HOUR for the next bus. From the schedule at Route 13 - Santa Clara Valley Transportation Authority, it looks like it doesn't runs weekends either.

    I posted about how bad it'd be if I depended on public transit to get to my former work at End of HOV lane.Whats your commute plans ? | Page 2 | PriusChat.

    I was taking a class a Foothill College earlier this year that met 4 pm to 8 pm on Tuesdays and Thursdays. It was ~30-35 min drive, each way for me. From
    Transit.511.org
    , if I had to take public transit to get there by 4 pm, it'd take me about 3 hours, 40 minutes to get there, including 24 minutes of walking.

    And guess what? There's no way to get back the same day. I'd have to sleep on-campus or somewhere because the next available route back after class is over is at 6:38 am, the next day.
     
    #22 cwerdna, Jun 30, 2012
  3. AlexandriaDumas

    AlexandriaDumas Junior Member

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    One thing no one has mentioned is that the Prius main battery doesn't last as long, or work properly if it isn't used fairly regularly, in my opinion. If your car sits there for weeks at a time, or is only driven five miles every week, you will eventually have problems with the battery.

    If it were me and I drove it rarely, I'd turn it in, or sell it for more than the residual and pocket the difference, and get a "regular" car that would not have the issues of the battery. I speak from experience with my 2001 which I gave to my mother in 2004 who drove very little. It wasn't a problem for many years, but the battery eventually failed in 2010 with only 35,000 miles, which is how I found out there were these types of issues as no one at the dealer mentioned this (perhaps they didn't know) and no where in any of the literature was this fact mentioned. As with so many things in this life, it's use it or lose it.
     
    #23 AlexandriaDumas, Jun 30, 2012
  4. pingnak

    pingnak New Member

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    I used to live in the mountains, and had plenty of curvy roads to play on, all the time. But driving all the time sucks any kind of 'joy' out of the experience, and turns it into a chore. There are always enough assholes to go around to make anything miserable.

    NOT driving underlines how improved life is without being enslaved to a steering wheel.

    Hypermiling took some of the drudgery out of it for a while, but to be honest, that doesn't take much of the boredom out of it. It only stretches the boredom out. Unfortunately, 'intermittent reward' doesn't have much effect on me. I don't get anything from gambling, either.

    When cars drive themselves, things will improve. Of course, taxi service would be a lot cheaper, too. I'd rather take a nap or read a book, than sit there, bolt upright, wide-awake, trying to constantly keep morons from killing me, sucking hours and hours out of my life, doing the most repetitive, boring thing possible that virtually REQUIRES caffeine stimulation to manage to stay awake.

    Driving is like working on an assembly line. It's repetitive. It's mindless. It's boring. It's stressful. You have to do it just a certain way. You have to do it at a certain speed. It's dehumanizing, too. Do you see other people, or do you see CARS? And long trips driving is even more like a sweat shop. You go long periods without breaks or even going to the restroom.

    I can walk to the store. If I didn't have to walk around a block wall that separates the neighborhood from the shopping center, it would be less than a 100 yard walk to a Trader Joe's or several places to eat. Within three miles there are a hundred places to eat, and three shopping malls, and many strip malls. Theaters, art galleries, etc. So far, I haven't HAD TO use any public transit. It's there, should I want a lift to the airport, or go somewhere that's inconvenient to drive to.

    When I lived in the mountains, I was five miles to the nearest 'convenience' store gas station, and ten miles away from a really small store, and at least 20 miles from anything else. But I was only a mile away from my MAIL BOX. I could walk to that rural box cluster. Someone even told me once how I was lucky to have SOMETHING I could walk to.

    Walking is mindless and repetitive, too. But at least I'm not sealed up in a metal can, waiting in line after line to do it.
     
    #24 pingnak, Jun 30, 2012
  5. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    Europeans figured this out a long time ago, but you are a rare American.
     
    #25 SageBrush, Jul 1, 2012
  6. pingnak

    pingnak New Member

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    I'm sure many New Yorkers have come to the same kinds of conclusions. Cars seem to be a great nuisance to own in the city. Nowhere to park, murderous, eternally gridlocked traffic, and abundant alternatives, including just walking.

    On the west coast, there's a mentality that says cars are necessary, and to an extent, they are, but you can certainly structure your life not to need one all the time by living somewhere that isn't in a desolate exoburb surrounded by nothing but other houses for miles around you.

    Cars certainly don't mean 'freedom'. If you have to literally march around in lines all day, and let any cop pull you over and shake you down at the drop of a pin, you're living in a police state. And you're always stressing "OMG! WHAT IF I LOSE MY LICENSE? WHAT IF MY INSURANCE GOES UP? WHAT IF THE INSURANCE DOESN'T COVER THAT $8000 DING?" On the bright side, if you 'accidentally' kill someone with your car, even if technically breaking one of the hundreds of traffic laws, chances are very good you'll get away with murder, as long as you stop and call 911 yourself, and aren't intoxicated or sent a 'text' in the last 10 minutes.
     
    #26 pingnak, Jul 2, 2012
  7. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    I'll agree w/you about New Yorkers, at least those in NYC. I think it's nuts to drive and own a car there for the reasons you cite.

    From the last part of your post and your others about having to avoid squishing animals and people, etc., I've concluded that you are a funny guy. :)
     
    #27 cwerdna, Jul 2, 2012
  8. pingnak

    pingnak New Member

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    I tend to rant a bit.
     
    #28 pingnak, Jul 2, 2012
  9. jabecker

    jabecker driver of Prii since 2005

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    Hmmmm... the last time I was pulled over was about 4 or 5 years ago. A very nice policeman mentioned that my tail light was out, and then asked me a bunch of questions about my Prius, because he was interested in buying one. I've never had a cop shake me down. I think I've had maybe two moving violations in 40 years of driving.

    I have never lost my license, but my son has a few times. He doesn't have a car now and either rides his bike or takes mass transit.

    Sometimes the traffic is gridlocked, but I look at it as a good time to get caught up on podcasts and audio books. If traffic is really not moving, I can also knit. Not much point in getting worked up over something I can't control.

    My car insurance went down when I bought my new 2012. My agent was a bit surprised. I have savings to cover emergencies.

    To the best of my knowledge, I have never hit an animal. Once a dog ran out from between two parked cars and hit me. But my car wasn't moving, and no damage was done to either it or the dog.

    I've never squished a human, with car or otherwise, although I have been sorely tempted a time or two.

    Guess I'll keep driving.
     
    #29 jabecker, Jul 2, 2012
  10. The Critic

    The Critic Resident Critic

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    +1

    This is very true. I live in an area with many retired folks, and this is something that my local dealer has seen occasionally.


    iPhone ?
     
    #30 The Critic, Jul 3, 2012
  11. pingnak

    pingnak New Member

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    Actually, didn't the Prius change battery chemistry to Lithium, from NiMH back in 2010?

    Are Lithium packs already failing, or are these the older design?
     
    #31 pingnak, Jul 4, 2012
  12. Judgeless

    Judgeless Senior Member

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    Where did you get this info? I read these forums regularly and have not read of one person that is has had a traction battery issues on a Gen III Prius.
    Why would you post something like this? Go to Wiki and type ‘Prius Battery type’ before posting something you are not sure of.

    Toyota did not change the battery type on the standard 2010-2012 Prius, it is NiMH. Nothing is failing.
     
    #32 Judgeless, Jul 5, 2012
  13. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

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    A lease is good for a business or for someone who wants a new car but can't afford it. Either way you end up with nothing but use of the car when it ends. There is value built in to the lease. In other words, the lease buyout is less than what the car is worth. KBB is wholesale, BTW. You and I rarely get to buy a car wholesale, but almost always sell it at wholesale at a dealer. That and the built in value at the end of lease is what the car dealership lives on.

    If you don't mind a bit of "work", buy out the lease and sell the car privately. You will make about $2000 to $3000 for a few hours of work.

    As you run your own business leasing is probably the best for you. I recommend you lease another new car, make and model your choice. One comment. Even though you operated the Prius in its most inefficient mode, you still got -much- better mileage than any other car on the road! Don't let the morons in advertisement and news media make you believe otherwise! Look at the EPA listing of vehicle mileage. The Prius is WAY ahead of anything else. And their numbers are fairly accurate. Just look at posted mileage figures.
     
    #33 David Beale, Jul 5, 2012
  14. Judgeless

    Judgeless Senior Member

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    That is a general statement. The correct statement is of you plan on writing off the use of a vehicle with leasing you can take the total amount you lease the car for one year, and use that write off. When you buy a car you have to break down the amount you write off over the life you own the car.

    The difference at the end is the same on the tax write off. Your company will save money in the long run if you buy vs lease. Eating a large portion of deprecation on the car every 3 years will always be a losing proposition.
     
    #34 Judgeless, Jul 5, 2012
  15. pingnak

    pingnak New Member

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    Oh, I fully realize the difference between range and mileage. 'Range' is what Chrysler advertises for its cars and jeeps with horrifyingly poor gas mileage, but enormous gas tanks. That way you can feel the pain at the pump less often, but far more acutely. Ford loves to advertise a car that comes in hybrid and conventional models, and quote the power of the six cylinder trim level, the fuel economy of the hybrid, and the price of the entry level four cylinder model, as if it were the same car.

    But for operating a vehicle so little that I put gas in it quarterly, I don't think it really makes much difference compared to the lease+insurance. I know if I fill the tank this week, I will need to do it again in October, some time. Barring road trips, which are infrequent, and could be done with a rental.

    As for why in the world I would say anything about lithium, maybe it would be confusing things like this Toyota article about the 2010 Prius and its first generation lithium ion battery pack.
    Toyota’s First Production Lithium-Ion Drive Battery

    It was more in the way of a question, when I asked it, anyway, considering the FUD about older, infrequently used Priuses.
     
    #35 pingnak, Jul 5, 2012
  16. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    No. All of the current Prius family other than the PiP are still using NiMH.
    I guess you missed prius 2010 hybrid batteries dead at 126000km and up on atleast 3 taxis i know of | PriusChat.
     
    #36 cwerdna, Jul 5, 2012
  17. Judgeless

    Judgeless Senior Member

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    #37 Judgeless, Jul 5, 2012
  18. pri2b

    pri2b Junior Member

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    take the car to Carmax and see what they will offer to buy the car. You might make a little money on it since it has low miles.
     
    #38 pri2b, Jul 9, 2012
  19. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    I wouldn't limit it to just Carmax (there are none near me anyway).

    I got a pretty decent amount for an 04 350Z that I sold to a Nissan dealer. It was better than than what a used car dealer offered me and the (very few) responses I was getting on Craiglist (w/my price on CL being lower than what the Nissan dealer finally gave me).
     
    #39 cwerdna, Jul 9, 2012
  20. pingnak

    pingnak New Member

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    I suppose the buy+sell route, then. I do love the car, but it's uneconomical to keep it, as it collects dust and literally collects cobwebs between the bumpers and the driveway. As nice as it is, I never use it. It's so sad.

    I'm leaning towards 'Cargo Bike'. Whether I buy it electrified, or mod it to be electrified is up in the air. This would manage the one situation I most commonly use the car for, which is just dashing out to get or do something in a rush, or going more than a few miles; otherwise I just walk.

    Something along these lines...
    Mundo 21 Speed v4.0 - Yuba Bicycles Shop

    They have an already-electric one, too... but I wonder if I could do 'better' with some other stuff.
    elMundo - Yuba Bicycles Shop

    With the basic motor+battery, it would have an effective range of 10 miles (20 mile typical e-bike range) on flat terrain (which everything mostly is, within 10 miles, all built up with bike lanes and back streets). With even a modicum of my help, much better range (since I walk for miles without thinking about it). With the kind of batteries a heavy cargo bike frame could carry (low center of gravity, too), I could easily build a '50 mile bike' with monster hill climbing capabilities... but far more research would have to go into that job.

    I will probably spend the money to start with a 'built' version, then move on to something more interesting via upgrades.

    I figure e-bike because it solves the big issue I've had in the past (besides safety and terror of traffic, which I'll have to address separately), which is going out plenty far enough to get tired... and then having the whole trip home to look forward to. I could walk all day and night, but what the fatigue riding puts on my legs is nasty, and I can hardly stand afterwards, let alone walk. And while hauling crap? Bah! Let the electrons do the work!
     
    #40 pingnak, Jul 10, 2012
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