GM adds third shift at Texas plant, 800 jobs (produces monstrosity class SUVs)

Still better seats than the rear ones in a Porshe 911.

 

Well, I guess most knew what you meant -- in current platforms HV or pure ICE, Prius is King.

There are a few of the "near dead" ones (think/transit/roadssters" still on the market.. hard to sell when there will be no long-term support or better models coming up soon. )

Most Volt's are in Volt in is CS mode so infrequently its lower mileage is not an issue. Current average on Voltstats is 126MPG overall. (And its quieter than a 911 too.)

Le Roi est mort, vive le Roi!

 

it's highly likely that this "I'm almost never in CS mode" claim is simply wishful thinking - based off the minority of Volt drivers claiming, "look at what I did" . . . us braggarts - like myself - who can achieve 75mpg , even in the gen II Prius . . . . or 5 miles per kWh (at the wall) in an EV. Fun to do, yes. But most won't/can't actually do this all the time. Still, we post about it when we do. We easily forget, that those of us who regularly post are in the minority - believe it or not. We like to think we're normal (posting on these boards) but we're not.
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SGH-I717R ? 2

 

Well you would be right about drawing conclusions from a sample of 1 being dubious. But my statement was not about me, I known I abnormal ( I'm at 92.4%Ev and 493MPG over the past six months..)

I did not say "almost never" or just talk about me.. I said

Which is easily verified.

And unlike fuelly or the PiP MPG spreadsheet, the overall data about the data about the volt is not self-reported data. The data from voltstat.net is automatically collected from the car once enrolled. GM is tracking all Volts via on-star, but that does not provide a MPG estimate or the same level of detail.

Voltstats has about 7.6% of the fleet (1149 out of 15000 Volts) which is statically very significant. The numbers I cited are from 1149 people traveling 8.7Million miles of which 6.2Million, clearly "most" of the miles are on EV not CS.

GM's overall "ticker" tracking milage were recently at

So over the whole fleet its alos clearly "most" miles are EV.


You might argue the average is skewed, so another way to look at it is how many people have > 50% of their miles in EV, which on voltstats is 1045 people out of 1149 (i.e. 90% of the people do the majority of their miles in EV).

You might also consider what fraction of Volt drivers have an AVERAGE MPG above your bragging number of 75MPG. On voltstats that is 1043 people out of 1149, so again 90% of the Volt drivers have an average at or above your bragging rights numbers.

You can also go to voltstats.net and see the oerall daily driving distribution as well. Most CS is used is on long trips.

So my statement was fully justifiable and cited voltstats (well I should have said voltstats.net) as the source of the data supporting it.

 

... and that's my point ... that volt stats (7%) ... or carwings ... etc are just us minority people. Most Prius / Volt / Leaf drivers just get in & stomp the pedal down & race to the next red light. They'll have no part in having their data being monitored via the various online/web based technologies. That's why the EPA #'s are different from what us posters are posting. I'd love to think it's so but most likely it's WAY presumptuous to think the majority of non-eco drivers are doing what we are doing with many of our numbers being way above the EPA. Yes that's just my guess ... but the epa numbers bear it out


SGH-I717R ? 2

 

Well I presented 5 different ways of measuring "most". One of these, the overall GM tickers, is all Volts so your point about it being minority people is wrong. Since overall ticker shows EV miles are greater than 62% of all miles, it follows "most" miles are NOT on CS. And my claim stands.

 

Worse...a defeated fleet of battleships that were too big and unwieldy to survive.

 

I am not saying you should go out and buy a two seater. I am just pointing out that the majority of cars with 5 seats, Prius included, are carrying only one person most of the time. So just because you never see a Tahoe or other large making full use of its passenger or cargo capacity doesn't mean the owner doesn't have an honest need for it.

I am a little disappointed that a story about a company hiring during a time when many people have been out of work for months or even years is used to condemn large SUVs. A vehicle class in which sales are down. Yes, it would have better if it had been a factory for hybrids or windmills. Trucks do have a usefulness though, and its better than a factory for bombs and bullets.

 

Back seats in a 911 means you got the wrong version

 

I agree many don't need large SUVs, but even if the entire public wised up, you will still see many on the roads simple because people are keeping vehicles over 10 years now and keeping an extra vehicle simply doesn't work for some.

The public hasn't completely wised up though. GM had to cut back production and lay off workers during the bankruptcy to the point that they aren't meeting a lower demand. If GM suddenly decided to take a moral stand and not produce these large SUVs to meet demand, the people would simply go to their competitors. GM expanding production isn't forcing people to buy them.

We have discussed to evils of large SUVs for years. We are in a period of tough financial times. Using a story on good news for these times to launch a repeat of the old discussion, I feel, is improper. I have said expanded production of other goods would be better, but there are goods that are worse.

 

Tahoe is the best selling large SUV, or as some call them monstrosity class. It does not get close to the sales of medium SUVs.

 

You can compare the classes

Toyota Monstrosity class Sequoia 13/17/14
HiHy 28/28/28
Highlander Ice 18/24/20
Prius 51/48/50

Gm Monstronsity class Tahoe hybrid 20/23/21
Tahoe ice 15/21/17

That monstonsity class tahoe ice isn't far from the highlander ice. Tahoe is the best selling Large SUV.

 

17.6% worse, actually. Using 17,000 miles a year, ~ $3000 annual difference in fuel costs, 8 tons of CO2 every year.

However, if you want to spin that difference as 'not far from [one another]', I should point out that the fuel economy ICE Highlander is about the same as the Tahoe Hybrid

 

The current gen is 5 years old, and isn't radically different from the previous gen.
Chevrolet Tahoe - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Then write your congress critter. I'll sign your petition. Pa classifies the Tahoe as a station wagon, and charges the same as a compact car to register it. It isn't GM or workers' they just hired fault I haven't taken action against it.

There have been numerous discussions about the evil SUV here through the years. Is it really necessary to sour some good news with another SUV diatribe? The hiring isn't because SUV demand increased. It's because GM was forced to underproduce in order to cut immediate costs and clear overstock.

 

I personally have no problem criticizing; if I did it would represent, to me, a lack of conviction or opinion, and I do have one, therefore I will express it.

I'm still of the opinion that as gas keeps going up these great large vehicles will become more rare, but I admit I would have expected that effect to kick in sooner. Gas has gone up a lot in recent years and is likely to keep edging up over time. Mileage on these massive vehicles is improving but not as quickly as gas prices go up.

A key measure is percentage of income spent on fuel. I know compared to the 70's it's no worse but it must be worse now than it was a decade ago. Unfortunately a lot of even small families (2 kids) think they absolutely must have a vehicle with a third row. Everyone of us knows multiple families with two kids who have a minivan or full size SUV. I even know a person who bought an extra-large vehicle in case she needed to carry her kids' friends around (which she for all intents and purposes never does).

It's a bit silly to extend the argument I just made to "Why aren't we all with two seaters?", well how many of us commute by ourselves to work? A lot, so why not a one-seater? Even if my car generally has only 1 person it very regularly has 3 or more. I had a minivan until last year and found that it was only 1-2 times/year I was holding more than 4 people, so now I have two sedans and for those rare occasions more people need to travel a second vehicle is used.