Changing our Car Culture

seems wasteful to include the entire post when I wasn't replying to every line of it

 

As a point of netiquette, selective editing is pretty standard procedure. If someone has purposely altered the meaning of what you said, or dishonestly changed the words to make it look like you said something you didn't, then you have every right to call foul.

But, if someone is distilling the essence of your post and responding to just one part of it, that's perfectly fair. It's nothing personal or malicious, and often makes a point clearer.

 

And yet you still haven't answered my question...

 

I thought that "oil wars" were a huge tax expense, not a source of revenue.

 

The question of who's going to pay for it? All of us, individually and collectively. We all pay for transportation. Every form of it is subsidised in one way or another, sometimes several.

Looking at the big-picture, long term view (which should be the role of government) if it's cheaper to buy more buses than build another freeway, then buy the buses. It's not a matter of 'my money' paying for 'your bus ride', it's a matter of what's best for society. We all share the costs, and we all share the benefits.

 

Ok so by your logic, since my tax dollars already pay for public transportation, and we are all going to "share the costs of transportation", who is going to pay my car payment for me

 

Hey, it was your choice not to take the bus....and to live so far from work...

Plus, I've already paid the other half of the road user costs you're not paying.

 

The Chinese? They provide all the loans for everything else these days....

 

Re: Chnaging our Car Culture

I was pointing out that one person's solution creates another person's problem. Some strategic thought about sustainability beats the heck out of tax code whack a mole.

 

op2:

 

The important thing to remember is that we are ALREADY paying for it. If the real cost of gasoline is $15, then we are all paying that price in one form or another. It isn't a matter of a higher cost killing the economy, it already is/has.

Might as well pay that at the pump, so the costs go to those that use it.

 

Re: Chnaging our Car Culture

OK. How about this:

http://sunnyday.mit.edu/steam.pdf

Quick synopsis: Boiler explosions were a common occurrence on early Mississippi River Steam ships trying to be the fastest delivery to and from the markets. The "conservative" answer was to let lawsuits force the steamship companies to reform. That did not work. All they did is raise the price to cover legal fees. Finally, the states instituted regulations requiring pressure relief valves and boiler inspections in order to be allowed to operate. Result was vastly less death, a more competitive market since death was not near the worry and more people were transported. You could still choose what line you went on (freedom) and you could work the Mississippi as long as you complied with regulations (free market).

 

Haha yeah I've been meaning to brush up on my mandarin.

 

Hey, I'm already paying 4/5 of the cost of your gasoline via my taxes and subsidies on the true direct and indirect costs of gasoline. That car payment is the only thing left to encourage you to make responsible transportation choices.

If I was Emperor of the World, you'd be allowed to drive whatever you liked, but there'd be a $15/gallon tax on gas, and no product could be imported from a foreign factory that paid less than U.S. wages, or that did not meet U.S. safety and pollution regulations. All those cars built in Mexico would suddenly be a LOT more expensive because they would not be able to pay workers $2 per day and dump pollution into the local air and rivers.

Car buyers have got it damn easy!

 

This country has been unable or unwilling to proactively change its car culture voluntarily and thus it will be forcibly changed by market forces. That is already changing. The price of gas has effectively tripled in the last decade (in some cases more). As it keeps climbing people will end up changing their own habits. I did. If gas were still $2 I assure you I wouldn't have a Prius. And if/when gas climbs and holds up to $6, for example, I assure you I'll dump the V6 sedan I also have now and buy another fuel sipper.

We can also see that although increased gas taxes would change behavior for sure, the behavior will change anyway because a barrel of oil keeps going up.

Some who are woefully unaware of technological advances in fuel economy keep talking this nonsense about re-urbanization and people leaving the suburbs. That's all rubbish. Most people would rather replace their minivan with a more fuel efficient vehicle than live on top of one another in the city. Urban sprawl is going nowhere.