confused prius vs volt

Which statement of mine were you referring to as a lie?

If it was about Gen1 Prius incentive, I was referring to the incentives during the sales (specifically in US), not during the development.

GM got US government money during PNGV and again for the Volt development, manufacturing and tax credit during sales.

The point I was making... since Volt was 10 years late to the US market, it has to compete with the existing green car alternatives, with or without plugs. It was something Prius did not have to deal with.

 

Its a hybrid and sacrifices acceleration and performance for efficiency.

Check out this thread post by a Prius Owner:

So that type of comment is not from me. there are who threads on PC on the issue.

Actually 3 of the top ten don't have seating for 5, they are pickups.
Agreed basic needs have to be met, but many people use a car mostly for single-person commuting.

The Prius Gen 1 did NOT sell more in the USA in its first year, it sold 5600 units, the volt sold 7671 or about 39% MORE than the first prius year.

Yes gas was cheaper, but the economy was booming not struggling to recover from a recession. Prius buyers, like Volt buyers, were probably NOT doing it just to save money on gas. There were/are many other priorities.

 

Sorry austingreen.. I tried really hard not to jump in an correct USBseawolf's Volt bashing. I was good for nearly a week but I could only stand so much. Since this thread may be read by people, other than the op, also considering prius vs volt, I just cannot let bogus statements or personal options presented as facts stand.

I try hard not to over push the Volt and minimize negative comments about the Prius family, but feel the need to defend the Volt from error political or bogus attacks.

 

I was just recalling Bob Lutz saying in about 2008 how he thought the Volt was going to be a game changer. Hm.

Said it before, the conditions are ripe and totally open for the Volt to pick up in sales. If it doesn't do it now, it won't do it until it is revised.

 

Hybrid electric vehicles in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Come on now, Dr. you know better. 2001 Prius innitially sold for something like last 4 months of year 2000 for the 5k ish figure. The model year 2001 and calender sales were 15,556.

The 'first year' figure for Volt was Dec. 2010. Forgot # but it was less than 1k.

Wasn't there a mild recession in year 2001?

 

Forgot about this post that you thanked on 3/2?

You said "Average american new car purchase is 31K". Did you mean new vehicle purchase? Can you provide the source please?

 

2000 Prius was on sale in all 50 sates or 5 months (Aug - Dec). Volt was in 7 states for the full year, with 12 states added in august and it was only on sale in all 50 states for 2 months. We'll see in November how well 12 months of sales in all 50 states work out for the Volt.

In Dec 2010 it was available in 3 states and sold 326 units.

 

If you are still looking for Volt/Prius PiP. On March 12, 2012 I was able to lease a brand new, non demo model, Volt from Serra Chevrolet in Michigan. With only $1564 down and no security deposit I was able to get a 2012 Volt for $280/month for 37 months and 30,000 miles. Serra Chevrolet Dealer - Detroit Southfield New Used Car Michigan

 

I thanked you for the data. And if you look at the months were the volt was available in all 50 states they were very similar to Prius data.


Yes its vehicles not cars, but I though it was 31 it was just 30.
data from
What You'll Pay: Transaction Prices Top $30,000 - Driver's Seat - WSJ

Average vehicle transaction price hits $30,000 in June | MotorwayAmerica

 

Ok... Guys... Seriously... We are going way the hell off topic from the original intent of this topic... Take it to another discussion, seriously. As AustinGreen said, its like two old ladies bickering, almost getting to howler monkeys ready to fling their own doo doo...

 

Nice. So some tax incentives some direct government payments, but you meant only US federal government to car buyers and make sure not to include them later. I'm not sure why japanese not us subsidies would matter to the OP, and you may just consider your statement clever and misleading instead of the lie it looks like to me. Nice limiting it to gen I, since as we all know the prius got direct US federal government incentives in the next generation.

umm. yeah. so what's the point of your misleading statements on the prius.

Japan is still giving the prius large tax incentives. The volt is here now, and all plug ins have to deal with a young battery industry. That is the point of these incentives. The volt did seem to beat the prius phv to market by over a year despite kit makers doing it to the prius for years. The prius phv needs to deal with the same cost issues and gets the same incentives. Now what in the world does all this have to do with the question of which car to buy. Just stop, and start anouther prius versus volt list where you get mad at the government for finally incentivizing plug ins.

Well there are corrections, but its gone beyond. No need to bash the prius because usb bashes the volt.

 

There were US government tax incentives to buyers of Gen I prius. I know I got a deduction for mine.

 

The typical person got $300 to $400 for their Prius purchase.

That doesn't even remotely compare to the $7,500 for Volt.
.

 

I agree, but the point is there was some government support at the expense of the tax payer. I got the deduction on the Gen I and a credit on my Mercury mariner hybrid and a credit on my home 220V EVSE. The leasing company got a credit on my Volt and a different leasing company got a big credit on my home PV system install.

Personally I prefer tax dollars going to support new technologies and energy independence instead of corporate welfare.

 

John,
I hope you will agree with me, that $300-$400 is more than nothing. That it is alright to correct down right lies and distortions, and that the billions of dollars the Japanese government has poured into the prius to make it a success, should not be ignored. The claim that the prius had no subsidies is just wrong. It is purely misleading and needed to be corrected. Saying it was only this much, then went up, is kind of a backhand rationalization for a distorted view. The correct response would be, I did not know that, I won't continue saying this not that I realize it was untrue. Hey, the Japanese taxpayer helped to get you your shiny new car, and the us tax credit made it less expensive for you to buy.

Now my main reason for calling this out, was it descends into a volt versus prius goodness argument that people have been carrying on inappropriately on every single thread. Even if the point was not a lie, it had nothing to do with this prospective prius drivers choice in 2012.

If you think that the current incentives are too high on a volt, leaf, prius phv, that is a different discussion.

 

What about the ignoring of the billions the US government poured into the "Prius" development here by the Big-3 during those same years?

Remember the PNGV project?

At least Toyota actually delivered a vehicle to consumers.
.

 

I stand corrected by gwmort. Now, stop bickering like an old woman.

 

huh. pngv was a totally screwed up project that accomplished none of its goals, and only those shills apologizing for the waste of resources and time make the false claim that it really got the prius out. At most fear of competition sped up the prius by a year or two, and I doubt that.

MITI's and Toyota's program was much more successful. We just shouldn't take the false lesson that Toyota did this without any help.

+1

Thanks, I resemble that remark. Was acting too much like a rock star last weekend, and now have been doing the same bad things I complained about,.

 

I sold my 1989 Honda Civic when I bought my 2004 Prius. I "sacrificed" the "fun" of a manual transmission, and the Prius handling was softer. But I gained considerably in acceleration, both off the line and at highway speed. So for me, there was no performance sacrifice.

Of course, I enjoy the neck-snapping power of my Tesla. But the Prius was no sacrifice. It's no Mustang, but it has perfectly respectable acceleration.

 

What is respectable? Well below average is the acceleration it has. It isn't debatable. It is a fact. There is nothing inherently wrong with being slower than average.