Coach's test drive of the Volt

That was what I meant. I was lazy to type it out the second time. I thought it was obvious that the "bad" was in reference to efficiency the first sentence stated as "good".

 

A well-designed EV (maybe any EV, but I'm not sure) is always more efficient than an ICE. As much as I consider the Volt a poor design and the best choice only under very narrow conditions, within its (small) EV range and for a short distance beyond that, it is more efficient than a PiP. Within the PiP's EV range, the Volt has more EV power (i.e. you can floor it without starting the ICE). Between 15 and 35 miles the PiP burns gas and the Volt does not. And for a few more miles the Volt burns less total gas because of the gas the PiP burns from 15 to 35 miles.

So within those narrow constraints the Volt is more efficient.

The problem is that for the Volt to remain more efficient, it cannot be driven too many miles beyond its EV range.

Toyota also has a better reliability record than GM, and the PiP is bigger.

It will soon be moot, though, because pretty soon there won't be any more gas and both the PiP and the Volt will be limited to their respective EV ranges, while proper EVs with decent range will make all PHVs and EREVs green with envy.

 

Daniel there will be more gas pretty much forever if people want it. It just might cost $15/gallon, but it isn't going away any time soon.

 

Sorry to show you the reality of some good mileage in the Volt to throw you off. That day while I was not using climate controls I definitely wasn't creeping along at the green stoplights as you suggest.

That happened to be a reasonable and short route to my destination on a Sunday afternoon there and Sunday evening back. The freeway was a several miles East of my start location then I'd travel North and head all the way back West so I skipped that annoying route that hardly saved any time.

I hot rod my Volt regularly in great weather depending on what I'm doing and going to that day. I have been hot rodding my Volt for the last four days. Sporty and fun this car is. Around here on the roads I take most of the Prius drivers are fairly old drivers it seems like 55+ to retirements just slowly cruising around.

 

Or from various articles people would rather buy a new car every 3-6 years and then don't see hybrids or electric vehicles as a good investment because they won't own them long enough. Or they like the latest smart phone and expensive data plans. Or love to eat out all the time. Or love expensive vacations as they've earned it from they hard work all year.

Of course many of these same people can't figure out why they don't have more money to save for retirement.

For year and years my wife and I (we're 44 now) drive our vehicles for a long time and thus save a lot of money as we invest after paying off the cars. Ate a home pretty regularly vs going out. Enjoyed very modest vacations. I'm starting to feel less and less sorry for the folks that complain about not being able to save for retirement but clearly make other questionable choices in their spending.

My MAIN point is long term car ownership.

 

When gas gets so expensive that people stop buying it, the companies that sell it will go out of business or change to selling something else, and it will no longer be available.

I agree with most of this. I lived extremely frugally most of my life. Now that I can afford it, I spend money. I've never borrowed. What I cannot afford I do without. For most of my life there was a lot I could not afford. I still don't eat out much because I like my home food. I do take a lot of trips, and I drive a very expensive car. I also own some expensive art. But those are really my only extravagances, and all fit within my budget without borrowing or threatening my financial future.

Advertising and credit have seduced Americans into living beyond their means, and have convinced them that they cannot make do with less.

But if we are talking about the Volt, sales figures show that relatively few people consider it to be worth the price tag. I'd buy it if the Tesla, the Leaf, the iMiev, and the Xebra did not exist. But it would be my last choice as an EV due to what I consider a poor design, inadequate range, and high price tag.

 

Are you predicting this is going to happen in the next 10 years, the time that people are going to be driving these phevs? Even with that distopian universe, wouldn't the volt which can go the distance of the majority of people's daily drives seems like it would survive. A hundred years seems quite pessimistic with known reserves.

 

A couple articles I was thinking of:

1) Even with $4 Gas, Few Drivers Choose Electric Cars—Or Even Hybrids
By BRAD TUTTLE | @bradrtuttle | March 14, 2012
Hybrid, Electric Car Sales Remain Weak, Even with $4 Per Gallon Gas | Moneyland | TIME.com

2) Will Higher Gas Prices Boost Hybrid, EV Sales?
Published: 02/28/2012 - by Michelle Krebs, Edmunds.com Senior Analyst
Will Higher Gas Prices Boost Hybrid, EV Sales? - Edmunds.com
.

 

It is the general issue I as referring to (see two articles above). Of course there is more to economics for owning a car as well. My Volt is
IS fun
AND sporty (low regen gear and sports mode)
AND looks_sharp (MANY comments from people at lights, parking lots, etc)
AND economical (200 miles this week and NO gas used - drive by the $4.29 gas stations today)

 

It will survive and it will drive, but Volt owners will envy Nissan drivers and both will envy Tesla drivers.

It may go "the majority of people's daily drives" but they will strongly feel the inability to go farther.

Come to think of it, what happens when the Volt tries to start the ICE, as it does periodically, and there's no gas in it? Will it cancel the attempt, or will it crash the program?

Of course it could all be moot. If we don't develop renewable energy infrastructure before the gas runs out, the inability to transport food will result in rioting and warfare in the street.

As far as existing reserves, it's easy to overestimate by counting extremely hard-to-extract reserves and failing to account for the exponentially rising demand from China and India, or the environmental impact of burning so much hydrocarbon.

 

Man you are a bit worried. I imagine in the mad max world you envision someone might pull a relay out so the ICE doesn't start Or something similar. Or use ethanol etc...heck they could do GTL or CTL still and we have years and years of liquid fuel.

 

...thank you for mentioning Gas-to-Liquids and Coal-to-Liquids (GTL and CTL). Currently there is quite a bit of venture capital R&D activity in these areas. However, current feedstock is cellulose (wood chips etc) for most of these projects. Right now the US Gov't is strongly favoring and subsidizing renewable approaches. However I wonder if some of these wood chip projects will morph into GTL and CTL plants.

 

GM thought of it already and it handles it. You get warnings but you can just continue to drive.

 

It would be way way better just to use electricity generated from coal or gas though. The liquids should be saved for airplanes and long distance transportation. Around town we should just be using electricity if possible.

 

...nat gas is so cheap, economics now very favorable for converting to liquids or methanol...probably see some if the price gap holds.

 

I know, but it still works out efficiency wise to burn natural gas in a combined cycle plant (especially if the waste heat can be used) make electricity and use that for cars in town. GTL is fine for other uses, but for inter city driving it is somewhat wasteful at a minimum.

 

I'm not worried. I drive a Tesla. And I drive it in hydro land. I just feel sorry for the people who think that hybrids, PHVs, and EREVs are going to get them through the energy crisis.

 

I envision a highly thermal efficient E100-capable engine working in concert with a big traction motor. In other words, PHV years from now.
.

 

Daniel I suspect that in 10 years, after people still are able to fill up their cars with more expensive gasoline, you will still have this mad max vision. Did you know that you can make gasoline with co2 from the air and water? That they are already building gas to liquids plants around the world?

Now most folks don't have the money to burn in a tesla. I doubt that buying a phev today will drain as much wealth that they will say. "I wish I had that car payment". Don't you think someone could possibly by a volt today and an ev when your disaster comes for less money than a tesla roadster

 

...I also favor nat gas electric = cheap and clean.
But I fear we will see relatively few new NG Power plants due to political pressures in favor favor coal nuke and "green".