How will the Chevrolet Volt be better than a Toyota Prius plug-in hybrid?

All the information is present. You just may not like the presentation.

The 2012 Volt display added a kWh consumption field although it shows energy at the battery level (the actual usable energy) rather than energy used at the wall socket (Nissan LEAF in-car displays are also battery-level kWh).

The automatic OnStar email report that Volt owners get shows the following data for the most recent month:

Fuel Economy: XXX mpg

Electric Consumption: XX kW-hr/100 miles

Electric Miles: X,XXX

Gas Miles: XXX

Total Miles: X,XXX

Percentage on Electric: XX %

This shows all the basic data. It is trivial to break this out in additional ways. For instance, electric miles multiplied by the electric consumption tells you the total kWh. Likewise, total miles divided by fuel economy tells you how many gallons of gas. Use that to divide the gas miles and you have the hybrid gas-only MPG.

I think GM could add an additional display screen or two to show this data in the car and it would be nice if they would crunch some of those alternate numbers for you in the email.

On the other hand, Volt owners are prompted to sign up to get these monthly email summaries when they receive the car at the dealership to remind them how they are doing on efficiency while Toyota doesn't have anything like this for Advanced PiP owners that I'm aware of. Also, the large majority of PiPs sold will be the lower-priced trim that doesn't have the telematics hardware to support automated customer efficiency reports like that.

 

I believe in many areas (California and Texas come to mind), wind power actually increases at night but I'm not sure if this is true generally at the national level.

 

Without massive water to land barriers present, the wind typically settles as soon as the sun sets. (The temperature shift causes the wind.) So unless you're on the coast of something, expect calm as the norm. A number of times I've taken advantage of that, delaying my biking & rollerblading until the evening... especially now that LED lights are so bright & efficient.

And of course, solar doesn't work anywhere after the sun sets.
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All our windstorms are at night. Ofcourse we have mountains very close to the coast.

 

Yes!

 

Are the turbines allowed to operate during storms? Here, I've seen them locked down in heavy wind. It's the gentle, steady breezes that are preferred.
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In my local area noon-4pm is "off-peak" same low price as at night because demand during the day is low. In our neck of the woods we don't have much "AC" demands so its that way all year.

I too believe its best to charge at night, and if my commute needed charging during the day it would still be better than gas during the day. And it would be better than a quick charge after work too.

 

I can (and did) buy wind power before my Volt. But now I buy more and don't buy gas.

There were, and probably still are, some scams in the wind market. That just means buyer be ware and do you homework, not that its all bad. Some people seem to think that its just about reallocating stuff that is already being generated. But the US curtails (i.e. turns off) a lot of wind power because it is cheaper for the utilities to use their coal plants. But if you buy the wind they have to produce it, even if it costs them a little more. Its not an instantaneous demand driven process, but demand still impacts supply.

Across the nations ( 34 states now I think) laws have been added that require the utilities to do proper accounting to track production to use. Illinois is one of them. With 150 wind companies in Illinois, and Iowa production up to now up (Iowa is now #2 per capita but sens much to other sates), but the 2.2c/MW production credit going away after Dec 31 of this year, I believe important that people vote with their money.

If your utility will tell you where you bought your "green" power then you can use the calculator at
Green Power Equivalency Calculator | Green Power Partnership | US EPA

to estimate your carbon avoided.

I do agree that in many areas wind is still not viable. The EPA green-power site can help people determine what is viable in their area for renewable energy purchases. But I would alway recommend you start at your utility and if in a deregulated state, the state's site on providers.

 

Actually good winds for wind-turbines are not generated because of daytime thermals. They are sustained wind higher up (why they are so tall) driven by pressure differences, not thermals.
Away from massive water/land boundaries, and aloft from frictional effects of the surface, the large-scale winds tend to approach geostrophic balance, i.e. it is the result of the balance between Coriolis force and pressure gradient force from large scale long-term pressure gradients. These force are why we have "jet stream" and influences winds at all levels.

Looking at the 80m wind energy map:




And the older wind-power map at 50m. you'll see two things.
The strong winds (best energy potential) at 50m tend to be in areas that in in the mountains or passes (with some water-based regions where the thermals are sufficient to sustained). But at 80m-100m (the new normal for wind turbines), the winds are best in the areas east of the mountain regions. This is roughly because the mountains compressed the air, which then expands on its way back down and produces wind. This is why many of the winds in eastern CO and TX are stronger at night than during the day. The cooling of the surface temps further reduces the local pressure and termal mixing and the stronger wind forces move down lower.

 

You can still purchase wind even if you can't use it. It will still increase the incentive to produce wind power. So you could buy wind in IA and live in VT. It would still make them more willing to pay the integration costs in IA.

And yes the wind blows more strongly at night and in spring and fall across most of the US.

 

It is true at the national level. In texas they use a 15% factor for wind, meaning they only assume15% of rated power during peak demand summer daytime hours. That means these turbines are pumping out much excess capicty at night. In winter they close down some coal plants, in summer they use less natural gas. More night demand from plug-ins with smart chargers will allow more turbines to be built.

If you notice, they don't really build turbines where you Rollerblade. Do adults still Rollerblade in Minnesota. Minnesota has many prime areas to add tall wind turbines. These can charge a phv at night just as easily as a volt.

How does that work? Is it one of the carbon trading schemes? In texas the choice programs and deregulation don't allow you to buy more than you use. I believe this is true for most of the country. It is a little different since the texas grid - ercot - is isolated.

+1

 

Honestly I am not 100% sure on the financials of it since I read about it quite some time ago, but in general yes the idea is similar to carbon trading, or renewable energy credits. A lot of states decided to make renewable standards (though often there are no teeth in these) and the same sort of trading scheme was discussed there. So a state with crappy sun and wind could buy credits from a state that had renewable (wind, sun, hydro etc).

 

Good stuff.

CO's rules are the same.. you can only buy what you use. And what is generated can only be used once, though all state buyers also count towards the states overall goals. However, I do belive that a power company can buy the green power and sell it to its customers without them agreeing to pay extra, so there is a market for unused, just a lower price that must compete with coal stations. That's hard when the coal stations run with negative prices in parts of Tx, ND and CO and more recently in the Northwest (where may be hydro vs wind). Check out this figure from the EPA



Negative prices make it very hard for wind farms to compete.. not only do they loose their income, if they don't sell the power they also loose a bunch of tax credits and such.

Note that ERCOT is only the part of texas (75% of the state's area 85% of its usage.) Luckily for me, the wind generators in the northrn part are tied in SPP (which has direct transmission lines to Colorado Springs areas). But West texas, in ercot, also has a lot of excess wind and negative pricing so they cannot sell it. There is now a project underway which could connect ERCOT to the rest of the grid by 2013 (Project to Connect Grids Raises Questions — Energy | The Texas Tribune) Its a fed project to ERCOT cannot easily stop it, but they could slow it down. The biggest concerns being raised is that the price of power could go up because Californians would buy the green wind-power which would raise the price. Good for America, good for the wind-farms, not good for those buying bulk power in TX.

 

On the subject of nighttime wind:

"Wind dies in the evening, taking the light with it.
Dusk before dusk in the river hollows.
Westward light glamors the wide Missouri, the foothills, the rockies, the arc of the harping coast.
And then the brooding continental night."

Points to whoever can identify the poet. And no, it's not me. (Caveat: this is quoted from memory.) Of course the poet was living at ground level. More points if you can pinpoint where the poet was living when he wrote those lines. (Anybody who knows the poem can answer both questions.) Of course none of this applies to the winds at 80 meters up. 80 meters is a long ways. I had a freediving instructor who has dived down to 85 meters below the surface of the ocean on one breath of air, but that's a national record! I've only been to 27 meters freediving, which is only 1/3 of an 80-meter wind tower.

 

Yes, in the texas brand of deregulation, any power company can give a non choice customer green energy - solar, wind, biomass, biogass without them asking for it. I am green choice wind customer, but my agreement states the obvious, the utility added that much wind to more than cover my needs, but its really shared with the rest of the city and some of my power is coming from the hopefully closed soon coal plant. Since the wind price was locked in for 10 years, I pay less than a standard user, but I do pay on my bill for maintenance of the fossil fuel and nuclear plants. New wind customers pay about $0.015 more than standard users and their price is locked in for 5 years.

 

I agree that nocturnal decoupling generally results in stronger winds aloft due to less influence from surface friction. However, absent mechanical mixing from a significant synoptic system, surface inversions can grow upward to several hundred meters at night typically.

Thus, wind turbines on ridge tops could actually experience increased winds at night, but wind turbines in flat terrain areas likely would not experience as much wind at night as during the day when convective mixing brings upper-level winds to the surface.

 

The midwest wind are, in general, very good in the plains.

Here is a quote from a paper on the subject

The night provides much leas turbulence which is why its energy production is higher.

 

In most markets it is the producer on the margin that sets the price in each hour for all producers. Since wind has 0 variable costs the wind units would be bid in at 0 cost and be a price taker. Other units that have a higher variable production cost (oil, coal, and natural gas) would set the price for each hour. As more electric charging is required by automobiles (and other loads shifted due to time of use rates) the difference between day and night prices will diminish as more loads are added to the night time/off peak periods.

Green credits created by wind generation are traded as a separate commodity from the actual electric power generated. Natural gas prices in many markets set the rate for the marginal cost of production. Natural gas prices now are very low due to a combination of excess supply and a weak economy. Be careful of your assumptions regarding savings because this can all shift quickly. While wind is playing a larger role it will not set the price and will be limited in concentration in an area due to reliability concerns.

 

I'm not quite sure that you understand the markets here. It costs money to turn on a coal power plant, so coal has a negative price at low demand, unless its off for a long period of time. Similarly there are regulatory effects on wind, these vary state to state, but wind producers get $0.02/kwh when its on in Texas, so shutting off costs them that much. As more night demand comes on line, more wind can be added to the grid. This is especially true with the smart grid we have here in austin, that can charge the cars when there is excess wind.

I'm not sure if you are saying this is how it is done in NY. It is definitely not done that way here.

We have found that the limit for wind is much higher than experts thought 10 years ago. ERCOT requires natural gas production that can be turned on when the wind does not blow. Wind/gas mix is proving extremely reliable. The rolling blackouts that came to my city in the winter last year were from problems with coal plants not being weatherized for the cold.

 

Personally, I'd rather have a hybrid where the battery is charged by the gas engine and the kinetic motion--rather than having to plug into an outlet. At least at current gas prices. Electricity costs money,too, and then there is the inconvenience of plugging in to charge overnight.