Toyota Announces Priority Registration Web Site for All-New Prius Plug-in Hybrid

Because the PHV prius will pollute on a regular basis and not only once the AER is exhausted? I don't follow your reasoning.

 

There is no reasoning, anxiety is irrational. Just like the 'range anxiety' claptrap.
At least I presume that was USB's point.

 

It's the hypocritical twist we had to deal with prior to your interest in Volt. The enthusiats claimed PHV was just a half-baked attempt to deliver something to compete with Volt... when in reality it has turned out to be the opposite. The PHV traction motor is more efficient and the combustion engine is both more efficient & cleaner.
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I agree it is unfair to describe the PHV as half baked, Toyota has been looking at it since hobbyists first started modding their own prii to plug-ins; and I don't mean to detract from the PHV's higher efficiency and emissions and all....

but in the context that was being discussed, a short commute that would be mostly within the AER of the PHV, if it involves any travel over 62 mph then the PHV will burn petroleum and a Volt wouldn't. It doesn't make sense to tout the PHV prius as cleaner in that instance.

 

It does make sense. All you need is to watch out for Wh/mile, whether from grid or from oil. More Wh means more emissions, CO2 direct and the others a bit exhaust treatment dependent.

 

GM's promotion of "no gas" for Volt is big part of that marketing problem everyone now has to deal with, since that clearly isn't the case. And what about how incredibly misleading the "230 MPG" campaign was? Then there's the issue of pre-conditioning...

Remember, Prius is a hybrid. Making the best use of a very small amount of gas at an affordable price is the goal. Adding a plug doesn't try to change that; it boosts the MPG significantly.
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Exactly. I tend to view the PHV as a 50-150 mpg car, depending on driver and cycle.

 

You can preheat with the power from the plug before driving it off. That feature can reduce the range reduction in extreme temp but it may not get 13 miles.

 

All true, I'm not saying its a bad thing the PHV prius burns gas; I've said before I wished the Volt would under certain conditions.

And the original comment I responded to was literally "dirty premium gas engine anxiety like in Volt", so I don't buy it was a reference to Wh efficiency.

If you are looking at which vehicle is going to be a dirtier gas burner in that short commute the answer is the PHV prius. The volt will be less electrically efficient (but perhaps not on a per pound basis) and have more evaporative emissions, I grant you.

 

The right tool for the right job. It makes perfect sense.

Volt's EV CO2 emission will be higher in that instance because it is using the wrong tool for the job.

 

Volt has ICE anxiety because of two reasons:

1) ULEV emission
2) Use of premium gas

That's what I meant. Prius PHV doesn't have that problem because the gas engine is the cleanest and runs on regular gas designed to run regularly.

 

It is likely that the powerplant emissions for the electricity burned in the Volt are worse, or at best the same, than the emissions from the petrol the Prius burned.

If generated emissions/mile is the argument, the Volt fares VERY poorly compared to any 50 mpg car in just about any scenario you care to propose.

 

OK,

I am talking to a contractor to install about 10kw photovoltaic system on my roof.

I propose you compare a Volt charged solely on solar power and a PHV prius (I'll even let you charge off my PV system) on a 30 mile roundtrip test run, 20 miles of which will be on the highway at 65 mph +.

 

Thank you for clarifying.

I know I have expressed some anxiety in the past over trying to maximize the electric range, but that had nothing to do with a dirty engine, I just don't like burning gas if I can help it.

 

Ouch. A 2.5 kw array will serve my home AND an EV. Do yourself a favor and cut down electric use first, then cover the remainder with PV. Solar heating is ~ 5x more efficient (and much cheaper per watt) than heating with PV.

The somewhat counter intuitive answer to your theoretical setup is that if you put up PV *because of the EV*, you win the argument. If you are going to put up PV anyway, you lose the argument.

 

Are you planning to charge your Volt at home during the day?

 

Only on weekends, the rest of the time I would sell peak rate power during the day to the power company and charge on off peak rates at night.

 

So only your weekend miles can be carbon free then.

How long will it take for the solar panels to break even? How much tax credit will you get?

 

Ironically it's another lease, no upfront cost at all, lease company gets the incentives and credits and the lease payment is less than prior power bill.

 

So what time do you think they will open the ordering? Pacific time or East Coast time?