Honda:Honda Insight hybrid was an "unmitigated disaster"

For now. Mazda has said that they are hoping to have the 2.2 Sky Diesel here in a year or two, and GM said they'll have some diesel cars here in about the same timeframe. But we know that many other manufacturers, like Honda, have said the same thing and then changed their minds. Guess we'll just have to wait and see.

 

That's the trap Honda has been falling into, instead of carving out it's own marketplace for a cheaper mild hybrid solution. The current price differential between the Insight and Prius is 4K which buys a lot of gas.

The IMA does have it's advantages such as being able to run with a dead traction battery.

 

Well, whatever trap it's in now the insight is outsold by the Prius by 6:1. The market has judged: Prius is a much better car. The insight is just noise in sales numbers.

Course, repeat sales and name recognition all help the Prius. Honda's hybrid tech is definitely second rate, though.

 

Finally someone got to the point: the fear of having a dead battery (similar to range anxiety) for the entire ownership period is something Honda have been thought before! Brilliant, tpfun ound:

I think Toyota made it better, thinking about another anxiety - run with a dead ICE, that is, on battery alone...

Can you balance between these TWO major advantages?

 

thats why toyota is best selling and not gm - gm cars suffer from break down anxiety

 

That's quite a stretch, even for TrashingPriusFUN to point out that the Insight can move with a dead traction battery.

 

I will admit Prius HSD is much superior to Honda IMA in the Insight. I drove the Insight and noticed a slight jerkiness when just starting to roll forward. Also the ICE comes on much more than Prius.

So, if you were stuck in stop and go traffic, possibly the IMA ICE would be coming on a lot, like everytime you move. Prius engine is chill in a traffic jam, just creep forward on battery, much better.

But, Insight is doing about #2 in sales for all hybrids, so I wouldn't call it an unmitigated disaster.

I see Insights around town. They are actually a nice looking hybrid.

If the Insight had the Prius drivetrain and dimensions, I would buy it over the Prius in a second, not just because it's a Honda, because I like Insight looks better than Prius.

Not going to waste my breath trying to tell Toyota how to stylize their cars. They could use some better industrial designers for that (Hint: big bump on nose look for Prius, boomerang taillights and floating bridge console)

This video perpetuates the whoopdeedoo image of Prius. They could have put Barney's voice in for this one.

 

All features I like. Nose reminds me of an F1 car or when Toyota built the GT1, the tail-lights are unique and cool and the floating bridge is probably the coolest center console design ever.

All humble opinions of course.

 

I wouldn't say it's similar to range anxiety, it's more like "punching a new hole in the pocket" anxiety for someone who wants to drive a beater Prius/Insight. Not replacing the battery is not an option for the Prius.

All manufacturers including Toyota and Honda are working on that.
But for Honda, unfortunately looks like this is at the expense of the IMA mild hybrid system...

 

Toyota had 3 generations for incremental improvements vs one for Honda. The Insight is a pretty good first attempt compared to Toyota Gen I (II?) for example. Unfortunately, in the marketplace, being late is never good even if the technology is viable.

 

LOL

That's a classic.

 

Can you explain that sentence more precisely?
You say a Prius will need always need a replacement of the battery?
I maybe look like a math geek, but I know that a double denial of an implication is a serious and not very easy approach...

 

He means -if- your HV battery completely dies you -must- spend ~$1,000 to keep your ~$3,000 vehicle on the road. With the insight apprently he prefers the redneck solution of just driving round with a dead battery in the boot...

 

I still think the Honda Insight looks good from the front. Just a shame it looks like they ran out of money by the time they got to the back!

I first looked at the Honda before the Prius and liked the styling but it's just too small behind the driver. Too compromised which is why it didn't sell.

 

Heh, i agree it looks nicer from front than back.

 

In a regular ICE or a hybrid car, many components can fail. And from a technical point of view, all rotating ones WILL FAIL sooner or later*. Battery, inverters, and wiring may last for "ever", since they are (almost) static and don't expect wear. It is a standard maintenance engineering approach.

Can anyone recall the cost for a regular ICE vehicle remanufactured gearbox? Or a turbo?
1000$ may be a lot of money, but may not be enough for a case like that...

* I have experience with long/lasting ownership of (classic) cars. One gearbox failed at 170k miles and 23 years old. Other one had to be overhauled with no more than 50k miles and 30 years old. This last one cost me 2000eur. But every year a lot of small other problems keep arising, all summed it is quite a value. It is unavoidable.

I wouldn't drive an Insight even with a good battery. After knowing a bit the Prius, I mean, and no offense.

 

Traction batteries degrade over time, something like 25% in 8 years. Leaf adjusted range may only be 53 miles after 8 years (down from 70 on the window sticker).

There is talk of 2nd life for traction batteries, maybe industrial purposes.

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As for the Insight, IMA didn't seem too good to me. Honda better pony up a full hybrid or keep getting mowed over.

 

Nissan says 80% for Leaf after 5...

 

That preview applies mainly to a "high rate" or "deep-cycle" usage (1st for the BEV and 2nd for a PHV), not in a narrow SOC like in our HV Prius.