PHV Release Date

It needs a factory equipped plug and the size of the battery determine the amount of tax credit.

Minimum qualification is 4kWh for $2,500. Additional kWh gets $417. Since PHV Prius has 5.2 kWh, it should qualify for $2,917.

I know it is better to go with the number of EV miles to take account of efficiency in the design but they used the kWh.

 

All signs point to Toyota dropping the ball on the Prius Plug in.

They had prototypes since 2007 (!!), had delays due to battery problems , and are now playing catchup to the new designs (their own and the competition's) and new paradigms (EV's).

I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

What do you mean? Not producing the PHV or ?

I hope they change the software so the extra battery can be regen charged all the time, like coming down a mountain pass or other long regen periods.

Mike

 

I don't think they have much confidence of the PPI's success in the marketplace otherwise it would have been released today. Any further delays will run into the next Prius and the plugin will be playing catchup...

Did you try braking more ?

 

All? Having driven one for a few days and observed Toyota's strategy for over a decade, it sure looks to me that they are taking advantage of the time to refine the system prior to rollout. There's hasn't been any pressing need and we know quite well Volt will have some fallout. Heck, even Leaf has a few things to deal with still. Taking that time appears wise.
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I sure wish I would have known that you had one in the Twin Cities as I would have loved to see it in person
I missed one in Orlando last week by a day. The salesman said one was at their store the previous day

Mike

 

Your personal experience with the Prius PHV will carry more weight when backed up with
details. Well ?

Toyota has been "refining" the Prius Plugin since 2007. 4 years is plenty of time to refine whatever needs to be done. A company like Toyota can develop a new vehicle in 20 months ! So, no, refinement is not what's holding up the Prius Plugin.

Nothing's stopping Toyota from a gradual rollout , if the Prius PHV design is competitive.
Toyota is simply not ready.

 

http://priuschat.com/forums/toyota-prius-phv-plug-in/83700-adventures-phv-model-prius.html
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Since the entire industry has been waiting for batteries, that's a weak argument at best. Also, let's not forget all the other hybrid efforts Toyota has also been pursuing at the same time. They're delivering quite a few new choices in a very short window.
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What bothers me is the fact that no data on field tests has been posted on their dedicated site Toyota ESQ Communications as promised some 14 months ago...

 

Toyota is busy hybridisng it's entire lineup, and keeping itself profitable. For the moment, in the grand scheme of things, that is more important.

It's easy to say "it's ready", but for those of use driving PHEV's, we know that what works great on day one isn't neccesarily still working on day two. or YEAR 10! Just look at the discussion about fuel dilution in oil of a PHEV we had on here the other week. For a user expecting an mpg boost for a couple of years on a 5 year old car it may not be a big issue, but putting that product into service with a 10 year warranty requires a LOT of confidence in it's durability. They don't have the confidence yet because the batteries haven't even been around that long never mind complete vehicles in real use. The fact the test fleet exists shows they are close, but still have some engineering problems to fix.

 

Wild specualtion tells me the results are not very good. Think fleet average of 55mpg.

In the same way some owners achieve 70mpg but others achive 35mpg, some plugins will have got 100mpg but others 35mpg. It's still good news to fleet operators, since their current prii probably get low 40's, but it doesn't exactly make good PR.

 

Getting it right the first time is more important. We would not want "half-nice person" release like the Volt, not reaching any goal set in the concept car.

Toyota has to protect the success of the Prius by not screwing it up.

EPA is not ready to rate the fuel efficiency. The schedule is to have fuel efficiency, emission, etc ratings ready by 2012. Toyota is moving along at the right pace. GM rushed out the Volt with a preliminary EPA label.

 

That has always been Toyota's approach. They aren't out to prove themselves like GM... which all the "vaporware" victory celebrations clearly confirm. In fact, most people aren't even aware of the Original model Prius, which demonstrated taking the time to do it right. They just assume the Classic model was the first.

I'm fascinated to find out what improvements the PHV ends up getting over the model I got to drive.

Remember, the goal is to sell many plug-in models (at least 20,000), shortly after rollout begins for a profit... no waiting for upgrades as with Volt... cost-reduction, PZEV emissions, improved efficiency.
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Exactly.
The current Prius PHEV prototype is basically a screw up. At some point, it needs to be totally redesigned without being restricted by the current form factor.

It would be a sad day when progress depends on EPA's schedules.

 

Vaporware is always fascinating.
I also read through your Prius Plugin thread but did not see any technical specifications such as vehicle weight, battery capacity, MG1/2 differences, etc etc.

When is that ? The 4th generation Prius will be released in 2015-16 so any Prius Plugin released in 2012-13 will be one generation behind in short order.

Should folks wait for the perfected 4th generation Prius (Will this be a Plugin only design ? ) ?

 

So they should have waited to release the Volt until the EPA got it's label right? With you, you chide GM for taking too long, then you chide them for someone else (the EPA) holding them up. The right pace for you is only where Toyota is.

 

It does seem odd to release it so far into a generation. We can only assume/hope that gen4 releases as PHV off the bat.

My personal expectation is that gen4 will be PHV only, leaving The Prius as as the most fuel efficient car in the Prii lineup. Already in the UK the Auris hybrid is better, and when the Yaris hybrid comes out that will be significantly better.

 

EPA use SAE J1711 to test the plugin vehicles. J1711 just finalized recently (July 2010). It is not just the EPA but the entire Society of Automotive Engineers. I am sure there is a proper process and someone broke the process in an attempt to change the game.

I have only said GM is 10 years behind for bringing out a hybrid car (not truck or SUV).