What's an Enginer like to drive?

My 07 Prius with a 4kWh system drives like a Prius with an EV mode button. The only notable difference is that you have the ability to drive further in EV mode than with just the stock HV battery. Also, the Enginer fills the HV battery generally at a slower rate than driving empties it. So, you tend to modify your driving looking for longer dwell times at traffic lights and also by driving a bit slower so that the Enginer refills the HV at a rate more commensurate with the draw from driving.

Regarding the reliability of the Enginer; I'm an installer so YMMV in terms of objectivity. The short answer is that if you want a pure plug and play system, the Enginer is not quite there yet. A latest revision of the system is currently being delivered in Europe and may have begun to touch down on US shores which MAY have completely worked through all the quirks of prior revisions. So, my comment may not be correct.

Regarding the reliability, I would say that it's a very simple system which has taken some large technical challenges, e.g., a 10x DC Boost Converter pushing 5kW and an inexpensive yet reliable cell balancing device for the lithium batteries. Given the simplicity, there's not much that can go wrong.

Any "wrong" I have found is heat related. I am living in a more extreme environment in south Florida where the days are typically at 85-90oF and the nights don't get below 80oF. Also, outside in the sun the cabin temperature is often above 140oF.

A key point to consider is that the heat ALSO affects the stock Prius system. The Prius HV battery is sensored and if its temperature gets above 114oF (very very easy to do) then the Toyota BMS shifts its algorithm to bias gas engine use versus electric mode. By the time the Toyota HV pack gets to 129oF, the Toyota software almost always REFUSES to allow the electric drive to be used at all. Of course, Toyota's algorithm which shifts operation to the ICE at higher battery temperatures then is in direct conflict to the PHEV owner's objective of maximizing electric motor use.

The last point to consider is that if you like homebrew, then you couldn't put such a system together for anything near the cost of the pretty well engineered Enginer unit. Further, if you wanted turnkey operation, then you shell out 4 to 5 times the cost of the Enginer system. So, given that the Enginer system is 90+% turnkey, if you can tolerate 10% teething pains, then it's a great option.

 

I'll pretty much agree with everything that Octane said. I had an enginer in my 2002 Prius, which I sold and bought a 2008. I currently have the new revision 5KW system on order. I have been waiting for 3 months because there was a revision change and all the new systems were back-ordered. However, those are starting to be shipped out now, so I should have mine in 10 days or less (I hope)

I had put serious consideration to the Plug-in Supply system, but the price was just too high and being that I knew I was going to be getting a Nissan Leaf in February-March of 2011 (when they start arriving here in Texas), I just couldn't justify the cost of one of those. The Enginer kit is definitely the best bang-for-your-buck.

In my 2002, I could routinely drive miles on end in EV mode, with the engine kicking in for steep hills or hard acceleration. Granted, it did require being very gentle on the throttle. I could achieve 80 mpg or better in that vehicle.

The problems faced before I believe mainly had to do with charging. The battery balancers in the old system were not very good and the charger could actually overcharge and destroy cells if left plugged in while unattended. THe new system is designed much better and should eliminate that problem, finally creating a "plug and play" setup.

 

Beware, Enginer don't really ship to you, they just have the kit dropped off at a port and you have to handle an unloader, import paperwork, customs clearance, and then pick it up.

 

Hmmm... I'd say you need to be able to use the resources on the web to program your scangauge to display battery current and be able to use the current reading to monitor the status of the system.

Alternatively, the new BMS with remote display may be all that you need to monitor.

If the system needs repair, you should be able to open the case and remove any of the bad components for shipping back to Enginer. Alternatively, you'd have your installer help you out there if you were anywhere near one.

Maybe the system is a lot more turnkey with the generation just now being released, so this 10% discussion may be a moot point.

 

I find that the Enginer kit doesn't work so well for hill; but it excels around town though, as the traffic light & stops allow the kit to further charge the stock pack. The assist also seems to do well on the freeway; as the Prius computer utilizes more electrical propulsion if the stock pack is fuller.

 

thank you for this information. This temperature effect explains what I am observing. I am now inspired to boost the air flow through the stock pack to keep the temperature down.

thanks

 

Hi Dolce Vita,

I have just installed an Enginer 4KWH unit into my 2005 prius. It is like driving a Prius on steroids. I average 3.2 l/100km per tank. I'm from Australia Sydney. Yeah I would have got a Hymotion too if I could. It was a two month delivery time to get the kit. It was a real PITA to have to arrange an import agent to unload kit and have it sent to my doorstep. The $250 delivery fee became about $1000 by the time I got it.

You can read my topic on the Enginer website: INTERNATIONAL BUYER BEWARE

Good luck.

 

This thread has piqued my interest a tad. Just curious, Lopez, how much were you charged for the kit in the end, and how simple is it to install ? Can somebody ( me ) with an excellent mechanical aptitude be able to DIY this Enginer mod ? How long would it take to do, roughly ?

If the 4kw kit is reasonably priced, I'd be happy to just self collect the package direct from Kwai Chung port over here in Hong Kong, which would negate any extra handling costs. I assume....

How much was the 4kw kit ? Depending on how much of an improvement it makes, I might even start installing these over here for other people, for a bit of extra beer money. In my neighbourhood ( Sai Kung ) there are 9 happy Gen II Prius owners that I know of lol. Petrol is frightfully expensive over here at $15.50 hkd per litre, ( $2AU per litre $7.6US per gallon ) hence the Prius is quite a popular sight on our roads.

I await your reply...

 

Anyone with mechanical aptitude can install one. Be sure you know how to use a digital multimeter and basic wiring.

The first install you do will take you the most time. Possibly a whole weekend if you take your time rather than rush. In the end, including tweaking it, the install in a gen 2 Prius will take under 8 hrs. You will make mistakes, but probably nothing that will damage things too much. After doing it you'll have a few "aha" moments where you'll figure out better ways of doing things. The only problem is, since the kit is constantly updated, not two installs are ever the same. Different components, different brackets, different bolts/screws, etc.

The instructions that come with it leave much to be desired, and some of it you kind of figure out as you go along. Especially for Gen 3 Prius which there are a few errors. Eventually you will figure it out. The dvd that comes with is sorely out of date and may not be of much use. In fact in one part it shows us cutting off a bolt, which is something you no longer need to do, and same thing with the drilling it shows on the front dash panel.

Until recently, every system I have installed had some sort of component issue, usually minor, but it made it so that you had to track down what was not working and confirm that it was not because of how you installed it.

Glad to help you if I can. I've been a part of over a dozen installs in Gen1 Prius, Gen2 Prius, Gen 3 Prius, and Gen1 Insights.

If you become an installer you will be doing others a great service by saving them the headaches and hassles. You will get to know all the little things that can go wrong and how to address them.

 

Try buying it of Ebay, you could save US$1000 Skyhook. This is the same company, it's a special Chrismas offer.

Prius Plugin PHEV Conversion Kit with Lithium-Ion 4KWH - eBay (item 200382634989 end time Jan-03-11 11:46:34 PST)

Contact the seller first and ask to be exempt from the shipping cost if you pick it up yourself. Also make sure that it is not a backorder and even if it is, decide if the US$1000 is worth waiting a while.

Good luck! Floyd

 

What you see on ebay is the same price as what is shown on the Enginer web site. (Left hand column.) www.enginer.us.

 

Ouch

Some time ago Hobbit criticized the spoofing approach that CalCars uses, and if I read him right, implied that durability is suspect as a result. I do not know if this kit would fall in the same category, but it is one more thing to consider in the purchase.

 

You're right Eric, I hadn't seen that.

 

It is my understanding that the Enginer kit does no spoofing, instead relying on slowly recharging the Prius' main battery or supplementing the energy needed by the Prius. Hopefully one of the Enginer experts can clarify if I'm not 100% correct.

 

Correct. No spoofing.

Simple slow trickle charging.

 

This thread piqued my curiosity about the enginer kit again, so I went and read the FAQ. It is *much* more enticing with a 5 kw trickle, compared to the 2.5 kw in the originals. I presume this is the newer two battery architecture.

I noticed one hint that I want clarification about. It mentioned that the accessory charging should be turned off when going down a long incline. I presume this is to prevent the OEM pack from filling up from regen and still have the enginer pack trying to shove energy into it. If this is the case, then what does happen in that situation ? Is it dangerous ?

 

At the factory settings the Enginer system will not shove energy into a full Prius HV battery. This recommendation is to be sure that regen is not waisted after the Enginer system has kept the Prius HV battery at a high SOC.

The Prius does have safety programming in place to handle potential overcharges. The important thing is that the Enginer system does not change or spoof the Prius programming in any way. This means that the Prius computers will still protect the Prius no matter what you do with the Enginer system.

Thanks,
Dan

 

Sounds good Dan, thanks for the explanation.

A big thank you to Ericbecky, for the offer of techo info should I need it in the future.


This forum is really helpful, minus the bored trolls that seem to have infected every other forum out there. A breath of fresh air .