20k Mile Service - I think they've used the wrong oil - again!

Good to know about bad performance of poorer oil... When I was in 15000km service they did ask me which oil I want. When I did ask for 0W they said that they don’t have it on tab, so they use can and give me leftovers of the can. It was nice, now I have Toyota 0W oil for my bicycle chains too... 8)

 

My NWH20 was a 2005 year model and the recommended oil was 5W30, I think they all used that weight. As far as I know there is no additional service for the ZVW30 that would cause your problem.

I guess I would just come out and say it, "I think you used the wrong viscosity of oil again . . . ." Next time be sure to remind them when you take it in, "it is not an NWH20 it's an ZVW30 and requires different oil". The chief technician probably does not have time to keep an eye on the guy in the lube bay. If it's like it is over here the guy in the lube bay is underpaid, overworked, and maybe not to careful.

EDIT: Actually there is one other thing, check your tires. If they have reduced the pressure, because their gauge is wrong or some other reason, and it will reduce your gas mileage.

 

Nitpick: 2009- Prius model code is ZVW30. The first two letters are derived from the engine family, the 2009 Prius has a 2ZR-FXE engine rather a 1NZ-FXE.

Dealers have a terrible habit of putting too much of whatever oil in. It should be a little below the MAX mark on the dipstick. I don't know why they have such trouble with this, to me MAX means 'maximum' and it's marked for a reason. (Well, I do know, they just dump in the prescribed amount from the bulk oil tank rather than putting enough to get to MIN then topping up. If it didn't drain fully - which it won't if cold - there's enough residual that adding the amount listed as 'capacity' will take it over MAX.)

It's quite hard to find 0W20 oil meeting the ACEA A1/B1 specs. The Americans have less trouble finding API SM grade, which is a lot easier to achieve.

 

All I can say is given your history with the service department and your current symptoms coupled with the use of the wrong service sheet I think your having your concerns is well founded.

If you are unhappy with the performance of your vehicle you have every "normal" right to express those concerns and ask for whatever protocal be followed...even if that means switching out the oil again. I don't think you need to feel bad about asking for this to be done.

Worst case scenario, your vehicle actually has the correct oil in it already...inwhich case it's a waste of an oil change, and a little labor for the technician..BUT you'd then know you have a different problem.

As far as being diplomatic? Just calmly express your concerns. Sometimes...often...these things go better than people expect.

Good Luck.

 

This is why I do my own oil changes. A bit of a hassle, but far less than trying to figure out what the dealership did. Many other benefits to this, like tracking other vehicle maintenance issues like CV joint boots.

 

:dizzy: oh god. i cant wait to see how they do me wrong here in greece! thanks for the heads up grumpy !

 

Can't you just do it yourself? It should save you time, money and the agony.

 

Burn me once, shame on you...burn me twice, shame on me.

I'd find another dealer. Ask for the service manager, explain to them your experiences and that you're going to give them an opportunity to earn your business.

 

In the UK does Toyota even use 5W-30 as a bulk oil, or something quite a bit heavier? Eg 10W-40?

The second summer I had my 2004 Prius, I had some heavy duty 15W-40 left over after servicing some heavy duty diesel equipment. It was barely enough to change the oil in the Prius

For summer at least, there was perhaps 2 mpg loss. No difference in how the motor ran

I would check the oil level first

 

With my 2004 Prius I tried Mobil 1 0W-30 and Mobil 1 0W-20. No difference in fuel economy

The 4 litre V6 in my FJ



the oil fill cap states 5W-30, but has been approved for xW-20. No difference in fuel economy but the motor made plenty of ticking noises running 0W-20

 

re;the amount of oil .. many cars oil stick is no accurate

 

They don't have 0W-20 oil in the dealership. Trust me. If they had I wouldn't have bought my own.

 

All Toyota parts come from same central storage in Europe, and if we have Toyota’s 0W-20 oil in here why your dealer won’t have it?

My service guy did say that Toyota recommends 0W oil, but they can put in cheaper 15W if I want to. I did pay maybe 20euros extra for 0W oil.

 

Just because something is available from the storage doesn't mean the dealer actually ordered it or keeps it in stock!

I would have thought that oil that works below -28°C was pretty important in Finland, unless you drive enough to change it in time for winter, or I suppose are far enough to the south. I took a holiday at Iso-Syöte in February, which started out at about -25°C (-30°C on the tarmac at Kuusamo Airport), although it was a balmy -7°C by the end of the week.

15W is not really recommended for winter driving even in Britain, in a regular engine. The Prius engine has a very tight fit of piston to cylinder to reduce blow-by, so requires a very thin oil to fit in there.

The 'W' part is tested at -18°C and is the number of seconds for a given amount of oil to pour, so 15W takes three times as long to flow than 5W does. 0W is a 5W oil that pours at lower than -40°C, though the working temperature for flowing properly round the engine and maintaining pressure is supposedly 20°F (~11°C) above the pour point. (The other part gives the behaviour at 100°C but is based on a different quantity of oil.)

The site I got this information from (Car Bibles : The Engine Oil Bible) recommends 5W-30 oil for cooler climates in ordinary engines.

Back to GrumpyCabbie's problem: if they used the NHW20 service data there's a chance that the engine oil could be too low. The service data sheet for ZVW30 gives a capacity of 4.2L with an oil filter change compared to 3.7L for NHW20. The two cars take very different oil filters - the ZVW30 has a cartridge design with a replaceable paper filter, while the NHW20 has a complete replaceable unit. If the filter isn't changed the refill quantity is 0.3L less.

 

It’s possible that I am confusing 15W to 10W or even to 5W, but my main point is that Toyota dealer can offer 0W oil if they want to. Just like you did say…

Not so many cars use 0W oils in Finland, because it’s “too expensiveâ€, with motor heaters (like Defa), you can start your engine in under -20 Celsius with poorer oils too.

I have been testing my “snow white†up to Rovaniemi City. It was then -20 to -28 Celsius there last winter.

I try to write more polite English, but I am sorry about my language skills…

Nice thing that you have been in Finland...

 

Wow very wierd

No issue at my dealer here in Texas (Pat Lobb Toyota) on m y Gen III. They mentioned the 0W20 before I even did and then confirmed it was what they used when returning my car.

I would definitely not let them off the hook until you can confirm what they used

 

AS to why they don't have 0W-20 I have no idea. I remember this one that my brother works for (a really big one here in London) and they don't even have fully syn and I had to buy my own oil!
But after a lot of customer complained then they switched to fully syn and thats only like 3 years ago!!

Even now they use the same fully syn as before so it is definitly not 0W-20 because they have this oil despensing machine and that goes to all the cars they service! So they all use the same oil except the diesel ones.

But If they did have 0W-20 I would have gotten free oil by now because my brother gets them free!! Like I said I had to buy my own and it cost me £120 for a bottle of 10 (10L). Why would I pay that when I can get it for free?

You think too highly of the Toyota these days.

There are some trade secrets I just can't tell here but you will be very very suprised what they are up to.

One heads up for people in the UK. If you ever plan to install a rear sensor at the back of your car at the dealers. Make sure when you buy you ask for Geunine Toyota Parking Sensors if you don't you will be sorry.