Model S buyers view of the Leaf

i guess i find it strange that the S would be considered a luxury car. its definitely not due to price. spendy it is, but put a 300 mile battery pack on the Leaf and what does that come to?? not a lot of difference in money i dont think.

i think many are willing to pay the extra money to get the extra space. i personally find it wasteful since 80% of the time, it will be just me or me and my son.

**edit** so its not quite as cheap as i thought being $50K after tax rebates so actually is more expensive. i wonder if many consider it a luxury car based on the Tesla roadster's Ferrari like demeanor

 

Well, that's where you're wrong. A Prius does make financial sense (if you consider it against an equivalent car of equivalent age). This has been discussed ad nauseum, but the hybrid costs are maybe $2500 over an equivalent vehicle. It gets 2x the mileage of an equivalent vehicle. $2500 in gas is 800 gallons at $3.12/gal, so in 1600 gallons (or 77K miles) you'll be money ahead. What, you say, you don't plan to keep your car for 77K miles? No problem, that's worked into the increased resale value for your car. Especially in the future when gas goes over $4/gallon again. Given that the average Toyota should be able to go 250K miles in its lifetime, it seems pretty clearcut to me.

EV's are a little harder to do the math, KWh per gallon conversions etc. But if you add in paying less to the military to protect our oil sources, we could save a lot of money. Having abundant fish resources instead of worrying about acidification of the ocean and collapse of the reefs and fishing stocks due to high CO2 levels, again we can save a lot.

 

I am comparing total $ spent, I may or may not buy out the Leaf at the end of the 3 year lease, that depends on how the vehicle does.

I think Nissan building 50K Leafs a year for the next 2 years, then being able to ramp up to 150K starting in mid 2012, they are much more likely to come out with a 200 mile affordable pack, than Tesla, making what, 3-5K cars/year starting in 2 or maybe 3 years? If they don't go bankrupt in the meantime because Nissan will own the EV market before Tesla even starts production of the Model S

The Prius is just an insurance policy, it costs almost nothing to keep it, since it was paid for with cash. depreciation means nothing to me, all cars are worth nothing eventually.

If the Model S where availble today, I would trade in my Prius and buy it, but that is not a possibility, and may never be.

 

For basic commuting in an electric vehicle, my first choice would be the Triac. It will be available this October for under $25K, but the highest range available is 100 miles. More than enough for me. And it looks cool.

 

I reserved a model S.
I canceled my reservation due to Tesla lying to me.
However, if I had not already I would cancel it now in favor of the leaf since the model S won't be out until 2012 at the earliest and more likely 2013.

 

Thats not the point.

All I'm pointing out is that - price is not the only thing to consider. Features are what we pay for - otherwise we would all be buying <the cheapest car>.

The features might be
- larger / smaller size
- luxurious interior
- status symbol
- "green" car

 

Actually the Model S is projected to move about 25-30 k by it's second year.

If I remember correctly Tesla has produced more evs than Nissan has in the last 10 years even at a 100k price point. I can see the LEAF being big overseas (where most of the reservations have come from) but with 100 mile range at best, will be marginal.

What is probably going to happen with the Leaf is a surge of early adopters and then sales will flat line. Especially if this 200 mile pack is only 2 years away. why buy one now if I can wait and get double the range by 2012. Nissan has a hard time convincing joe regular to give up his range of being able to drive anywhere s/he pleases. Convince people to pay 20k more for a car that has a quater of the capabilities. You and other EV enthusiasts can live with that compromise, but the general public won't.

 

actually more than 70% of reservations for the Leaf have come from the US

 

What might happen is, the early adopters are seen nationwide by the end of 2011 driving around in their zero emission Leafs, talk them up, and raise awareness, and perhaps convince many others to look into EVs and some will even buy them.

Nothing is better for sales than word of mouth advertising, and actually riding in a real EV. Tesla should really step up their game and get the Model S into production as soon as possible, so they can claim the high end of the EV market, otherwise Infiniti may claim it.

 

Who ever mentions something related to range - never ever mention the fact that 60 million households in the US have multiple cars. Nissan isn't even targeting people without access to an ICE car to go longer distances once in a while.

 

i thing i found concerning range is that 100 miles verses 300 miles would only affect me a dozen times a year and i know that. but most neigh-sayers say is that they need 500+ miles because they cant or dont want to drive more than that in a day and figure they will just charge overnight.

what we fail to realize is that we dont often travel that far (i mean 100 miles) in a day. i feel that i am in a unique situation as there is a major city 50 miles away so every trip there is more than 100 miles by the time i get home and we do get to Seattle a half dozen times or so a year for one thing or another. i did notice that sometimes we went there more from habit than need.

there is now an Apple store in Puyallup (LOL!! u dont even want to know what spellcheck suggested!!) which is only 30 miles away (hence RT less than 100 miles)

but then again, we are a two car household. we use the Prius if we are going out of town or actually i would have to say, will use the Prius if we are going beyond the next town over. for all else, the Leaf will do just fine

 

It "makes no financial sense" to ever buy any new car. It "makes no financial sense" to own both a car and a motorcycle. It "makes no financial sense" to own any luxury or classic or muscle car. It "makes no financial sense" to eat at a nice restaurant rather than to eat at home.

People who have disposable income buy things they like. Once basic needs are met, our buying decisions are not based on "financial sense."

I own both a stinker and an EV because I LIKE driving electric, and there is as yet no EV available that can replace my stinker. Even with a 300-mile range I'd still need the stinker for road trips to Canada for hiking in summer.

A Leaf would replace my Xebra, not my Prius, because I still want to be able to drive to Canada. If you assert that I have "more money than sense" because I like to drive electric when I can, I could just as easily say that you have "more money than sense" if you own anything you do not absolutely require to meet your most basic needs. I own an EV not to "pay myself on the back," but because I enjoy driving an EV, and I want people to see EVs on the road so they will get used to the idea that electricity is a viable way to power a car.