If It's Just a Software Fix, Why the Delay?

Toyota has a worldwide network of dealers. Each and everyone of these needs to be notified, informed about the issue, informed about the fix and so on. This process requires time.

 

The really sad thing is that I think you are serious.

 

I don't think, or it is my guess that it has little to do with the logistics of distributing the software.

So far the only official statement from Toyota is that they are "thinking about how to tell the customers", which I don't quite understand.

To me, the longer it is known that a software update was applied to Prius being currently produced and Toyota has no official response for those that have purchased earlier, the worse it makes Toyota look. They need to communicate what they are going to do and why.

I'm sure they wanted to avoid another negative headline BUT they just have to swallow this pill. There also might be legal implications and further considerations as to whether it is done as a service campaign, TSB or a full fledged recall.

I would also speculate that there is concern about admitting that the 2010 has a braking issue worthy of an software update and commiting to that process because it leads directly to the follow up question which would be "How about Generation 2?" and Toyota might be hesitant to open that can of worms.

Believe me, in a way I feel sorry for Toyota as I can understand from a business standpoint why having the Gas Pedal Recall coincide with now trying to handle Prius Braking software issues is just a horrible reality. Especially with the media attention and even Government Agencies paying Uber Attention.

But I don't see anyway around it. Special Service Campaign, TSB or Recall...an official announcement should be forthcoming or Toyota undermines the very statements they are currently making about being commited to customer safety.

 

Since Toyota has been so secretive, we don't exactly know the requirements for the upgrade. We are driving vehicles that are basically half-car and half-computer. It could be that they changed CPUs during a production run or something and have to alter code for earlier systems. It could be that they have yet to test it on earlier models. Firmware code is often written specifically for hardware.

On the other hand, I think they are just holding out on us. Maybe they want to encourage upgrades from 2010s to 2010 1/2's.

 

Bout time....They've notified dealers, now they need an official response to customers...

 

Apparantly you have never worked for a large company, and are not familiar with how slow large companys move. It's like turning a large ship, it's done slowly and methodicly..

Mitch

 

Maybe Toyota is not sure if the current factory fix would work while collecting consumers' responses from the January car owner. Or maybe it is not just as simple as a software update and they haven't decided how to tell the customers just like they used to do. I kind of feel that Toyota's main focus is on how to downplay the issue and protect the benefit more than customers' safety concerns. Remember a couple months ago Toyota dealers usually told the customers not to worry and it is normal and you need to learn how to drive, this is new technology. But now Toyota dealers say they were not informed either at that time. I believe dealers might not know the issue either at that time. The question is if you see more and more customers feedback on the same safety issue would you still say "don't worry, it is normal"? Now we hear dealers say "don't worry, Toyota will take care of you". And you question when would it be fixed? They say "I don't know either". But they know you don't need to worry.... And even they don't know what's going on but they know it is safe to drive...

 

I can't forget that after I purchased my Prius, the dealer said that I would be getting a survey from Toyota. The dealer asked me to answer every question with excellent. I was asked by the dealer if anything wasn't excellent, to tell them and they would address my concern.

Now after I called my dealer to tell them that my brakes felt like I was skidding on ice after applying them on a bumpy road, the dealer tells me that they don't know anything about that problem. Time to cut the crap. If the whole world knows that the Prius has a brake problem, how can a Toyota service dept. not know? They are either liars or idiots.

I would have given Toyota the benefit of the doubt but when they are correcting the problem on the assembly line, that means they knew there was a problem. If this didn't come out, I believe that they would have ignored it. Why didn't they immediately correct the Prius's software on the first production cars as soon as they started to do it on the assembly line?

I lost my respect for Toyota. I love my Prius but not the company that built it.

 

NEILZ: Yesterday I drove my 2010 Prius through the most crueling weather conditions, heavy rain & flooding, bumpy roads and all; did not experience even a hint of braking problems or hesitation. Felt extremly safe & secure. Why do you find it necessary to bad mouth such a wonderful product & responsive company such as Toyota??

 

Try to keep things in perspective and look at the big picture. They've been struggling to deal with the accelerator issue, something with much greater exposure than a brake update (of which has only been recently available). We're talking a very short amount of time with deal with an extremely large exposure. Halting operations clearly demonstrated effort to divert resources.
.

 

While this shows an appalling lack of understanding about health related software, (you were hoping it would stop your car, right?) it is dwarfed by the lack of understanding about the number and independence of Toyota Dealers, all of whom will need training and parts. (What if the upgrade 'bricks' your car?) Further, while you call it software, I bet it is really firmware burned into a EPROM or one of it's descendants, so there will be a ramp up to manufacture a quarter of a million of them and get them shipped where needed.

 

While the idea of a secure Internet download may sound good, I'll bet large Corp like Toyota on car firmware changes are more likely distributed via something more secure along the line of a cd, possibly even pressed. In this situation, it would be harder to change things as you go but the tradeoff is improved security and reliability. You think the firmware programming machines are Internet capable? Hardly likely, and dangerous of it were. This is no diff than many other hardware manufacturers. If you take a close look at most modern electronic components, you will note hat the very same model, even produced in same year can have different hardware revisions. Example in point: linksys routers have evolved while maintaining their model designations. Only the very observant will note the actual hardware revision, yet you would never expect linksys to supply a fix to all existing routers. Again, case in point. Netgear sold quite a few new gigabit routers that had trouble with jumbo frames. Later revisions this bug was fixed, but you wouldn't expect and hey didn't do a recall of their router to fix the problem. in the end, I'm sure it was just a software problem but I don't think it would have been an easy fix to distribute

 

The most likely explanation is that they shouldn't happen almost instantaneously.

Do you really want anyone quickly changing a complex life safety system before they have a chance to determine whether they are dealing with a single problem or a number of similar seeming problems, before they can determine whether there is a single cause or multiple causes, before they can think through the multiple implications of possible "fixes", before they can develop the most promising solution, before they can do thorough testing, before they can go back and fix any problems with their first "fix" and before they can thoroughly document it and before they can train those who will need to implement the changes on your car?

I believe that the main reason we have for worry at the moment is that strong expressions of concern by a small portion of customers, a media frenzy and political pressure, may be forcing Toyota to act too quickly and greatly increase the chance that something that is undesirable but relatively infrequent and without any clear correlation with accidents or life safety is inadvertently changed into something with far more serious consequences.

 

Maybe you are a lucky and I am happy for you. If I were as lucky as you I would be very pleased.

 

I am with you re your comment.

Isn't it interesting how many Priuschat patrons were "singing the praises" of the Prius a month ago ... and now so many readers have turned on them. We live in a society now where there is no limit to "character assination" half-truths and down right lies about those that do not agree with ones vews. Congress has taught us all how to be vicious and "mean-spirited," and we seem to have learned very well.

Personally, I would much rather Toyota take the time to get the software fix right than rush an inferior ... or worse yet, and "fix" that makes things more difficult. Every [computer] operating system that is released has been tested and retested ... but once released, issues crop up that require adjustments.

The Prius was, is, and will continue to be a fine automobile. I have confidence in my Prius and Toyota. It is very difficult to be number 1 .... everyone is "gunning" for you. Government Motors has a tremendous incentive to discredit Toyota ... and those efforts are not helped by the "snipers" that have posted such rediculious messages on some on these threads.

 

As trivial as you may think this is, it is not just a simple software problem. Because this braking issue involves a number of complex systems and only occurs less than 1% of the time, it takes quite a bit of vehicle testing to devise an acceptable solution. Before this "software fix" is released, Toyota has to thoroughly re-test their modifications over a wide range of driving, road, and weather conditions. If they were to release a "fix" before they completed all of the necessary testing, and if the "fix" didn't cover 100% of the cases; I'm sure that you would be the first one to scream that Toyota didn't do their job right.

Keith