NHTSA Tracking Braking Loss on Prius Hybrids

Here is the bump where I first ran into trouble shortly after I purchased the Prius. I drove by there today and was able to reproduce the effect braking semi-hard going 15 mph, but it was not nearly as profound as the other times and didn't bother me one bit.

I'll try again tomorrow..

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=A bump on Mulholland&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=26.592957,59.326172&ie=UTF8&cd=1&hq=&hnear=Mulholland+Dr+%26+Cahuenga+Access+Rd,+Los+Angeles,+California+90068&ll=34.124547,-118.358637&spn=0.006768,0.014484&t=h&z=16&layer=c&cbll=34.124477,-118.358561&panoid=frpts_v3yf44tSDlDuopsA&cbp=12,326.53,,1,12.2

 

Yep, while braking. I reproduced it on my way home, 10 minutes after making my post, on the same bump. (it's actually the dark asphalt patch in the street view link i posted, not the crack)

 

I've gotten it several times on a particular freeway overpass. Just after accelerating to the crest of the hill, I hit the brakes lightly before taking the on ramp to the right. Seeing the photo, that road seam is exactly where it happens.

San Antonio and 101 - Palo Alto, CA

 

This issue was mentioned on the 6:00 am news on WJR (local AM powerhouse) today. It is also on the front page of the Detroit News. The article claims there have been 2 accidents involving injuries.

The host on WJR was just talking about it again and joked saying, "It is not true that Toyota has recommended that since the Prius is so small, owners cut a hole in the floor and use their feet to stop it, all while yelling YABBA, DABBA, DOO!" I'm sure the UAW folks are loving every second of all this...

Toyota hit by Prius brake complaints | detnews.com | The Detroit News

 

I cannot believe they are investigating this as hockeydad said it's not an issue. You would think they would listen to him with all of his nice posts... LMAO Nice try Mr. Shill!:wave:

 

I have had several exciting experiences with the braking on my 2009 Prius. Complained to the dealership about a week after I got the car and was told they had nothing that could be done to change the way the computer reacted. Now I dread having to touch my brakes on rough surfaces at any speed for fear of loosing braking even for a split second. Add to that the traction control dropping off when you try to pull off from a stop light while wet or touch the painted stop line, it just makes for an exciting experience. I am pointing at the programming of the computer being just too sensitive to ral world situations.

 

Just heard a mention on NPR that the NHTSA is investigating 2010 Prius braking issues.

Then found this BBC article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8495132.stm

When it rains, it pours.

 

It's a coordinated rain.

 

This is all too funny.

The "NHTSA is Tracking Braking Loss on Prius Hybrids"? Just now? really? Hello?? If they had been paying attention, they would have known that this sensation, this feeling, this phenomena, and possibly (TBD?) this problem has been around quite some time. G2 owners have been reporting feeling the same thing - for quite a while. In all that time has there ever been a formal "investigation" by the NHTSA on this issue? I don't think so. Why not?

This is now news because of all the other stuff going on with Toyota.

 

After reading most of the posts about Toyota's troubles (mainly other than the Prius), I have to conclude there are two camps of thought - the glass half full group, and the group who says it's half empty.

Case in point - some won't buy a Toyota, or want to unload their Toyota because of recent events. That clearly is their choice, and not every situation is the same for all. But other's look at it as an opportunity to buy because they should be able to get better deals. I for one would never think of unloading because: (a) I keep my cars for well past 10 years, so this too shall pass, and (b) If anything, recent events will make Toyota much more customer friendly about doing all it can to keep customers happy. When I went to buy my Toyota this past Summer, I got the very distict feeling from the sales department that if i didn't want the car, at the price they offered, they had 10 people behind me waiting to take the car. Same thing in the service department - cordial, but not overly helpful. I suspect a bit of this smugness will now change...and this change will benefit me, directly...so why would I consider unloading a perfectly good vehicle? It makes zero sense to me. But that's for my situation.

 

Look, we all know the loss in brake force after striking a bump or pothole is not new. What is happening is that the NTHSA is unloading all of the complaints it has received on Toyota now to cover its own nice person. Just think what would happen to the NTHSA if they were aware of the Toyota related complaints and not brought them forward to the public? The bottom line is that Toyota needs to address the issues quickly and transparently (I'm not convinced Toyota has been as transparent as it should). In the meantime, however, more people die each year from fatal falls off ladders. Maybe the media should turn its attention to addressing the safety risk associated with ladder use for a while.

 

Exactly.
When do you think is the best time for getting Toyota's attention to defects esp braking issue in their vehicles ?

 

Thank you for this comment...most of us do not have an "agenda," we are just here to learn and share and, in this case, to know we are not alone in experiencing this braking phenomenon. I agree wholeheartedly that education -- around any new technology --is the best way to set expectations and assimilate.

 

Does anyone subscribe to the kyodo news service? I can not not read their full article. Evidently they say that vibrations cause a problem with a brake sensor. It would be great if someone with access to the full article could confirm this.

A brake sensor malfunction would help explain needing the double bump to hit the right frequency range to screw up the brakes. Some sensors may be worse than others, which helps explain why some cars experience it and others do not.

There is also evidence that there is badly behaving software that has been there in generation II makes these conditions worse.

Its sad that it has taken two injury accidents and the government of japan to get Toyota to start publically addressing this issue.

 

Well congratulations complainers. Have you ever driven a ford fusion or another hybrid or electric car? When you brake with two tires you avoid potholes. It's simple. /sigh

Now I'm going to have to watch for what their "change" is and be extremely careful not to let them "update" my car. I imagine the only thing they are going to do is decrease the efficiency of the regenerative braking. Hopefully they will do a customer education fix instead of an ecu or computer behavior fix.

 

For all of you who say it's just not an issue, I ask you, why would Toyota meet with Japanese officials who then release this kind of information:
“There is a small computer inside the brake and Toyota is making adjustments and improvements,” Economy Minister Masayuki Naoshima said yesterday after meeting with Toyota Executive Vice President Shinichi Sasaki, according to comments broadcast on NHK. “For cars currently being built at the factory, measures have already been taken.”

So, it seems that Toyota is DOING something about the issue regarding the braking in the 2010 Prius. If those of us who have experienced it are just imagining it or making a mountain out of a molehill, then why would Toyota start to make adjustments to the cars and hint at a possibility of a recall of the 2010 Prius to remedy this issue???

I applaud Toyota. I predicted long ago that this would escalate into a real problem for Toyota as it became more public...and I think Toyota will, eventually, come out of this in an even better light than they were in before it all hit the fan. There might be a few bumpy months first- so those of us who've had the brake failure sensation from bumpy roads, watch out- but I think more highly of Toyota as a company now than I did before.

Oh, and a new rule: All of you who said that either we were imagining it, or it wasn't a real issue, or that we just don't know how to drive, or that we're not experienced or smart enough to drive a Prius- you can't get your ECU's replaced or your brakes adjusted when they start to issue the recall....

 

Yes Bighouse, all of the veteran members here who have been driving Prius for half a decade or more are wrong, and your right. Not, it's just that now there's enough people who aren't experienced or haven't studied hybrid or electric drive technology have complained. Toyota itself has at least mentioned that part of the problem might be that they aren't educating the customer well enough. Toyota is responding to these complaints because they are being forced to. Enough people could complain about water being clear and force the municipality to put dye in it to protect us for some bogus reason - if enough people complained about it.

I'm honestly just at a loss here. I mean, if there is an issue with a fraction of a second braking transition between regenerative and friction brakes, then you are following way too close or traveling way too fast.

 

Now I understand why they locked out the nav while moving. I'm sure they are going to do something to the car to cater to the masses. If it saves some pollution then I'm all for it. I just hope there won't be an efficiency hit. Maybe they can make the brakes intermittently apply to keep the pads warm and ready, and maybe something else to keep the brakes ready.

If it does result in a noticeable loss in efficiency then hopefully there will be a hack around it like ewert did for the mg1 and mg2 motors.